Author Topic: What Happened To My Convict?!?  (Read 15217 times)

Offline Ratty

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 30 October 05 08:10 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Genni
That's great....I'll get on to it.
Donna
ALBONE - Bedfordshire and Medina area, New York State, USA, SAMUELS - Bedfordshire, COTTINGHAM - Huntingdonshire and Leicerstershire, CLAY - Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire, ASPITAL - Northamptonshire, SMITH, RATCLIFF - Staffordshire, BERESFORD - Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, WHYLER Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, VINE- Kent and Sussex, BUTLER - Norfolk, GEORGE - Norfolk and Northumberland, JOHNSON in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk

Offline Ratty

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 01 November 05 08:10 GMT (UK) »
Hi Genni
Just wanted to say that I downloaded a copy of the marriage certificate of Thomas and Phebe this morning and it's definitely the right Thomas....birthplace and parents match perfectly.
Thanks for the link you gave me.......now I just need to try and follow any descendent's.
Donna
ALBONE - Bedfordshire and Medina area, New York State, USA, SAMUELS - Bedfordshire, COTTINGHAM - Huntingdonshire and Leicerstershire, CLAY - Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire, ASPITAL - Northamptonshire, SMITH, RATCLIFF - Staffordshire, BERESFORD - Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, WHYLER Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, VINE- Kent and Sussex, BUTLER - Norfolk, GEORGE - Norfolk and Northumberland, JOHNSON in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk

Offline gennig

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 01 November 05 09:01 GMT (UK) »

Glad I could help Donna.  when I get a chance I'll see if I can find out when he arrived in Victoria.

Let me know if you want any info on Emma's children.

Cheers
Genni

*******************************************
All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

*******************************************
Surnames:
Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould
Areas:
Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan

Offline Ratty

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 01 November 05 19:58 GMT (UK) »
Genni
Any info you have or come across for Emma's children would be great and much appreciated.
Donna
ALBONE - Bedfordshire and Medina area, New York State, USA, SAMUELS - Bedfordshire, COTTINGHAM - Huntingdonshire and Leicerstershire, CLAY - Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire, ASPITAL - Northamptonshire, SMITH, RATCLIFF - Staffordshire, BERESFORD - Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, WHYLER Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, VINE- Kent and Sussex, BUTLER - Norfolk, GEORGE - Norfolk and Northumberland, JOHNSON in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk


Offline gennig

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 03 November 05 07:50 GMT (UK) »
Hi donna

John Stewart & Emma Albon's children:-

All registered Footscray

Thomas Albon Stewart born 1874 (ref: 15928) died 1877 (Ref: 4849) aged 2
John Thomas Stewart born 1884 (ref: 9566) died 1886 (ref: 5434) aged 23mth
Rroy McGregor Fairbairn born 1891 (ref: 3311) married Janet Gibson McGregor 1917 (ref: 8139)
Alphtruda Kathle born 1893 (ref: 3940)
Emmalee Myrees H born 1893 (ref: 3941)

Cheers
Genni
*******************************************
All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

*******************************************
Surnames:
Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould
Areas:
Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan

Offline sparrett

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #14 on: Friday 04 November 05 03:27 GMT (UK) »
Hi Donna,
It will be a giggling pleasure to add Emma's children names to the summary (PM yesterday).

Either she became a little eccentric in her choices of names or someone couldn't spell very well.

The Alpha.... is very unusual!!!
Sue
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline JAP

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #15 on: Friday 04 November 05 08:53 GMT (UK) »
Hi Donna,

Thomas and family
One wonders whether Thomas actually had any surviving descendants.

Genni listed two (pre-nuptial - 1860 and 1863) children with Phoebe (MANSFIELD) JUDD but both died in infancy.

Did Thomas's death certificate say how long he had been in Victoria?  Can the death of George JUDD be found?  Any records of births in Vic to George and Phoebe?

One wonders whether Emma ALBON (b ca 1852) really was a child of Thomas ALBON and Phoebe MANSFIELD or did she just (and perhaps other children of George and Phoebe) adopt the ALBON name like Joseph and Sarah - presumably we think that Joseph and Sarah are children of George JUDD and Phoebe MANSFIELD (as they arrived with them in 1849) and that both subsequently adopted the name ALBON.

Of course, Thomas may have married more than once and might even have had descendants before he took up with Phoebe.

I have researched a convict who married a widowed ancestor of my children (she was past child-bearing age by then).  I found that the convict had been married and had a child in England before he was convicted and sentenced and transported to Tasmania in 1834 (descendants of that child had always assumed that he was the convict's only child).  Then, in Tasmania, he married (1847) and probably had at least one child (fate unknown).  In 1853 he married again and had a child who survived and had descendants.  He moved to Victoria with this wife and the child. The wife died in 1859 and he married yet again (in Victoria) in 1860 and had 12(!) more children.  That wife died in 1888 and after less than a year he married my children's ancestor - the marriage was not a success, they parted, and he died in 1891.

Tasmanian Archives
As Trish said, the Tasmanian Archives has a Research Service.  It would add to the available information if you could get (if you have not already done so) all the information which is held by the Tas Archives re Thomas.

The Archives site says the following:
"Convicts
The records of the Convict Department and the administration of the Convict System are a valuable source of genealogical information. More than 74,000 convicts were transported to Tasmania between 1803 and 1853. Conduct registers of male and female convicts arriving in the period of the Assignment System 1803 - 1843 provide much information. [CON31 and CON40]. Until June 1840 convicts were either assigned to settlers or sent to work on public works but in the early 1840s the Assignment System was replaced with the Probation System. On arrival convicts were placed into gangs to work and the length of time in the gang depended on the length of their original sentence. There are similar but more detailed conduct records for this period [CON33 and CON41]. The information contained in the conduct records can be supplemented by using other series of records such as indents, descriptions and muster rolls. The Convict Department in Tasmania did not retain butts of indulgences such as Tickets of Leave and Conditional Pardons but simply noted the fact that the indulgence had been granted on the conduct record."

Brief Guide No 13 lists Records most frequently used for personal information about convicts.  It is at:
http://www.blaxland.com/ozships/events/12/1142.htm
Guide No 20 is also interesting.  It is at:
http://www.archives.tas.gov.au/guides&Info/guide020.htm

Lady Nugent
From:
http://www.blaxland.com/ozships/events/12/1142.htm
the 'Lady Nugent', a convict vessel with master Jas Fawcett, left Sheerness 11th July 1836 and arrived Hobart Town 12th Nov 1836.

Victorian Death Index, 1921-1985
Janet Gibson (MCGREGOR) STEWART - mentioned by Genni - died aged 42 in 1936 at East Malvern, parents Mcgregor Jno and Harriet Annie Archer GIBSON, Ref 2648

There are the following deaths with father Joseph ALBON (and mother Harriet YOUNG).
*ALBON Harold Leslie, father Joseph, mother Harriett YOUNG, died age 67 in 1952 at Wggi, Ref 17772
*ALBON Albert Victor, father Joseph, mother Harriett YOUNG, died age 73 in 1956 at Rich, Ref 6643
*DUNBABIN Susan Ethel, father Albon Joseph, mother Harriet YOUNG, died age 73 in 1956 at Koru, Ref 18852
*ALBON Thomas Edgar You, father Joseph, mother Harriet YOUNG, died age 84 in 1962 at Elst Ref 19868
*ALBON John Stewart, father Joseph Judd, mother Harriet YOUNG, died age 78 in 1967 at Fran, Ref 27952

And a child of Harold Leslie:
*ALBON Malcolm, father Albon Harold Leslie, mother Agnes Craig JEFFREY, died age 20 in 1935 at Wthaggi, Ref 17277

And children of John Stewart:
*ALBON Thos Ronald, father Albon Jno Stewart, mother Eliz HENDERSON, died age 19 in 1947 at Pran, Ref 11869
*GRAY Joyce Isabel, father Albon John, mother Elizabeth HENDERSON, died age 45 in 1963 at Trar, Ref 9700

And Joyce Isabel's sons:
*GRAY Theodore Walter, father Gray Reginald David, mother Joyce Isobell ALBON, died - no age give - in 1936 at Pakenham, Ref 15958
*GRAY John David, father Reginald Dav, mother Joyce Isabel ALBON, died age 21 in 1959 at Trar, Ref 26512

And her husband:
*GRAY Reginald David, father David, mother Maude BROWN, died age 71 in 1969 at Bool, Ref 16328

JAP

Offline sparrett

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #16 on: Friday 04 November 05 11:05 GMT (UK) »
Hi Jap and all,
Yes.  We also  wonder why the change of name for George Judd.  He was married to Phoebe Mansefield as Joshua Judd in quarter Dec 1841 (Freebmd).  When they arrived on the Royal George,with 2 of his ? 4 ? children he was George. (Assisted immigrant1849, per gennig).
  Should search death under both first names. Finding death would at least mark the beginning of Phoebe's widowhood/availability for re-marriage.

There is an entry for the Lady Nugent arriving in Hobart 12/11/1836. Thomas Albon is listed on board with 286 convicts.  The ship departed London 12/7/1836 (Sorry I can't quite re-locate my source on that).
 Which ties in with Donna's conviction information.

 1863 Sands McDougal shows Thomas Albon as a brickmaker -  Moreland & Parker Streets, Footscray, Melbourne.
This goes on for a few years, changing to Storekeeper in same street.
A death entry we have established for Thomas Albon ( 1872 aged 56 b. Bedfordshire ) may explain why in 1874 Phoebe is recorded the storekeeper.
And this continues for some years. There are also records of a Mrs Matthew Albon living in the same area from about 1879
All of this is only of interest and does not offer any real evidence of Thomas having children in Aust. .
Also of interest, the possible grandchildren of Joseph and Harriet appear on the   www.ww2roll.gov.au  site.  Some of the names are very familiar, including next of kin.  Thanks Sue
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Ratty

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Re: What Happened To My Convict?!?
« Reply #17 on: Friday 04 November 05 20:46 GMT (UK) »
Hi Everyone
Well I miss one day of checking my messages and haven't you all been busy!
Yes I agree Sue those names are somewhat unusual!  It's exactly as they appear on the birth certificate though...seems as if they were twins with Alphtruda being fractionally older than Emmalee.
Jap, Thomas's death certificate dated 27 December 1872  says that he had been in Victoria 25 years which we know is not strictly accurate, but then it also says that he married Phoebe Mansfield 25 years earlier in Essex, England!!!!  Which as I now have a copy of their marriage certificate which states that...... Thomas Albon a bachelor (not quite sure what his wife in England would have to say!) married Phoebe Judd a widow on February 19th 1868 in Victoria ...... would seem to also be stretching the truth a little.
Also to add to the confusion on Alfred William's birth certificate (Thomas and Phoebe's last child) it gives as the other children of both Thomas and Phobe......Mary - deceased, Joseph 18yrs, Sarah Ann 14 yrs, Eliza - deceased, David - deceased, Emma 8 yrs, John Thomas deceased.
Joseph, Sarah Ann and Emma all name children after Thomas and all give Thomas as there father although it is obvious that it is not actually the case.
I have contacted the Tasmanian Archives and they are goin to look out all records they can find of Thomas for me.  I don't know if that will help or just add to the questions!!!
Donna
ALBONE - Bedfordshire and Medina area, New York State, USA, SAMUELS - Bedfordshire, COTTINGHAM - Huntingdonshire and Leicerstershire, CLAY - Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire, ASPITAL - Northamptonshire, SMITH, RATCLIFF - Staffordshire, BERESFORD - Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, WHYLER Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, VINE- Kent and Sussex, BUTLER - Norfolk, GEORGE - Norfolk and Northumberland, JOHNSON in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk