Birth - Significance of who registers a birth?

[Galium]

Legally, a child born to a married woman would be deemed to be the child of her husband, no matter what the truth was, and therefore the husband would be recorded as the father on the birth certificate. 

It is quite likely that Edith Annie didn't know this - why would she?  So she may have sent someone else to avoid making a false statement herself.  However, if she had gone and told the truth, the entry in the register would still have had to name her husband as the father. 

Depending on whether Florence Wells knew who the baby's father actually was, it's also possible that she went to spare her friend from having to tell the registrar - and then discovered that she didn't need to.

[Rowan Tree]

Hello again,

I've just found something interesting.

When I was looking at Florence E. WELLS' children earlier, I missed a daughter who was visiting her paternal aunt and uncle in Workington, Cumberland on the 1921 Census.

The daughter is Ada WELLS born 10/12/1915 in Newton-le-Willows.

On the 1939 Register, Ada is still in Workington, living at the same address.
Ada has the occupation of NURSE MIDWIFE recorded!

I've currently got two separate examples of mother/daughter midwife duos in my family tree. I'm wondering if Ada WELLS' mother, Florence E. WELLS was also a midwife.

It is by no means certain that Florence was a midwife, but it's very interesting to know her daughter was.

It's also interesting to know that Florence's husband, Wilfred WELLS, once live in WORKINGTON, Cumberland as a child with his parents and siblings at roughly the same time as Edith Annie MADDOCKS was living in Workington with her parents and siblings. It's worth noting that the MADDOCKS family were in Workington for approximately 3 years only.

It could all be just a coincidence. But it's an intriguing one.

[Rowan Tree]

Legally, a child born to a married woman would be deemed to be the child of her husband, no matter what the truth was, and therefore the husband would be recorded as the father on the birth certificate. 

It is quite likely that Edith Annie didn't know this - why would she?  So she may have sent someone else to avoid making a false statement herself.  However, if she had gone and told the truth, the entry in the register would still have had to name her husband as the father. 

Depending on whether Florence Wells knew who the baby's father actually was, it's also possible that she went to spare her friend from having to tell the registrar - and then discovered that she didn't need to.

That a good point! I hadn't considered that.

Thank you 

[goldie61]

Hello again,

I've just found something interesting.

When I was looking at Florence E. WELLS' children earlier, I missed a daughter who was visiting her paternal aunt and uncle in Workington, Cumberland on the 1921 Census.

The daughter is Ada WELLS born 10/12/1915 in Newton-le-Willows.

On the 1939 Register, Ada is still in Workington, living at the same address.
Ada has the occupation of NURSE MIDWIFE recorded!

I've currently got two separate examples of mother/daughter midwife duos in my family tree. I'm wondering if Ada WELLS' mother, Florence E. WELLS was also a midwife.

It is by no means certain that Florence was a midwife, but it's very interesting to know her daughter was.

It could all be just a coincidence. But it's an intriguing one.

How very interesting Rowan Tree!
The hairs went up on the neck of my neck when I read this!
Of course it could just have been a co-incidence, but very intriguing as you say.
Funny where this family history research takes us isn't it? 

[AntonyMMM]

Legally, a child born to a married woman would be deemed to be the child of her husband, no matter what the truth was, and therefore the husband would be recorded as the father on the birth certificate. 

For registration purposes, not exactly. Under common law there is a presumption of paternity within a marriage so that is what allows a married woman to register her child and have her husband entered as the father on the entry without him having to be present to agree ( as an unmarried father would).

If a married woman does name her husband as the father knowing that to be false, or impossible, then she would be committing perjury.

[Sc00p]

My grandad, Arthur Robert MOORE, was the sixth and final child of his parents. My grandad was born after his dad had been conscripted and sent to fight in WWI.

My great-grandad, also named Arthur Robert MOORE, was recorded on my grandad's birth certificate as Sapper no. 178150 no. 1 company Royal Engineers. Journeyman Stone Mason.

I don't know the date when my great-grandad was conscripted and thus, can't confirm he was present when my grandad was conceived. It seems certain that he'd been sent to fight in WWI by the time my grandad was born on the 13th December 1916.

The 126th Field Company went to France in Sep 1915.  ARM Snr doesn't appear to have been awarded the 1914-15 star so that implies he hadn't served overseas before 31 Dec 1915 and joined up with them sometime after.  As conscription only began early 1916, I don't think you can be certain he was conscripted, maybe he joined voluntarily. 

Have you considered that Florence Cave may be related to the father of ARM Jnr somehow and not just a friend/midwife etc?  She has an older brother who is proving to be elusive post 1901 census.

[Rowan Tree]

How very interesting Rowan Tree!
The hairs went up on the neck of my neck when I read this!
Of course it could just have been a coincidence, but very intriguing as you say.
Funny where this family history research takes us isn't it? 

I know, right!

I've now realised that although the MADDOCKS family were in Tranmere, Cheshire by the April 1891 census, Jonathan MADDOCKDS, Edith Annie's dad, visited Workington, Cumberland after the move.

On the 14th August 1891, The Workington Star reported that Mr. J Maddock, Birkenhead, delivered "a capital address." I think Maddock was a misspelling of Maddocks and I believe it says Birkenhead, rather than Tranmere because Birkenhead was where Jonathan Maddocks worked.

[Rowan Tree]

The 126th Field Company went to France in Sep 1915.  ARM Snr doesn't appear to have been awarded the 1915-15 star so that implies he hadn't served overseas before 31 Dec 1915 and joined up with them sometime after.  As conscription only began early 1916, I don't think you can be certain he was conscripted, maybe he joined voluntarily. 

Have you considered that Florence Cave may be related to the father of ARM Jnr somehow and not just a friend/midwife etc?  She has an older brother who is proving to be elusive post 1901 census.

Thank you for this. It's very helpful.

I can't see any evidence of ARM snr receiving the 1914 - 1915 Star. So, I think we have to assume he didn't become a soldier until 1916.

I've thought a great deal about conscription verses volunteering. I don't like to think he would have willingly left his family but I don't know for certain either way.

There are several things that make me think he was less likely to volunteer.
** He turned 34 in January 1916.
** He had three young children and a wife at home who were dependant on him.
** The family didn't have any extended family in Newton-le-Willows and didn't have a local family unit to fall back on. The family had left Manchester and the extended MOORE family when they went to live/work in Newton.
** Edith Annie was estranged from her family and they weren't local either.
** The family hadn't been in Newton long. The latest I can place the family in Manchester is the 10th December 1912 when their son, Valentine, was born. The earliest I can place the family in Newton is the 26th April 1915 when their daughter, Cecelia, was born.

It's admittedly difficult for me to think he left by choice.

I've been looking at how Florence could be connected to the family. If she is related, I'm yet to work that out.

I think I know who our biological relatives are in place of the MOORE's through DNA matches with living descendants.

I'm think we're descended from:
Samuel BARNETT b. 28/04/1851 in Hulme, Manchester
d. 16/09/1935 in Oldham, Lancs

Elizabeth Barnett nee ASPEY b. 14/11/1854 in Bidston, Wirral
d. 25/01/1926 in Chadderton, Lancs

That's not to say that Florence doesn't fit in somewhere with the above couple, though. But Florence has Suffolk ancestry and my DNA indicates that I don't. Or at least my mum doesn't and it's my mum who is a MOORE.

I really wish I knew when ARM snr left Newton for war. Not that knowing this would necessarily solve much. I still wouldn't be able to say if he was or wasn't my grandad's dad if he was around when Edith fell pregnant.

I'm still pondering and searching. I feel there is more to discover 

[Galium]

Under common law there is a presumption of paternity within a marriage so that is what allows a married woman to register her child and have her husband entered as the father on the entry without him having to be present to agree ( as an unmarried father would).

If a married woman does name her husband as the father knowing that to be false, or impossible, then she would be committing perjury.

Thanks, Antony, I didn't know that.  So if a married woman goes to register the birth of her child, and names a man who is not her husband as the father, what information is entered in the register, if he is not with her?
In 1916 would the index  still show her married and maiden names?