17th Lancers 1894-1902

[RowanR]

Hi, I hope I gave this the right name, I wasn't sure what to use. My great grandfather Edward Nicklin served in this unit during the above period but all I can tell from his service record is that he was in the Boer War, and I was wondering how to find information on what he might have been doing the rest of the time. (I've found a little bit of information about what the 17th Lancers did during the Boer War on www.angloboerwar.com but if anybody knows where to find any more I won't say no)

The dates in his record are:
Transferred to the 17th Lancers from the 2nd Battalion North Staffordshire Regiment 1 Sep 1894 (he was originally attested 10 October 1893) and he was transferred to the Army Reserve on demobilisation on 24 December 1902 (discharged on 9 October 1905)

His service is listed as
Home               10 Oct 1893 – 14 Feb 1900 (6 years 128 days)
South Africa   15 Feb 1900 – 10 Sep 1900 (146 days)
Home           11 Sep 1900 – 2 March 1901 (235 days)
South Africa   3 March 1901 - 26 Aug 1902 (1 year 177 days)
Home           17 Aug 1902 – 9 Oct 1905 (3 years 44 days)

I do know that he was in Fulford Barracks in York in 1897 because he marries at Fulford on 12 April 1897, also his son Harold Clifford Nicklin is born in 1900 in Cork, Ireland. His other children born whilst he's in the army are born at York or at Tutbury, where he is from, so I'm guessing his wife Florence was staying with either her family or his and not with him when they were born.

Also he has the following medals listed
Queens SA medal with clasp
Cape colony and O F State
Kings medal with clasp
S A 1901
S A 1902
As far as I can tell they just mean he served in South Africa for at least 18 months, was there in 1901 and 1902 and served in the Cape of Good Hope and Orange Free State but not in any specific actions.

Any help gratefully received, military history is an area I really don't know about.

[ShaunJ]

Interesting that his wife and children aren't listed on his military history sheet. It suggests that he married without permission from the Regiment.

[Andy J2022]

Shaun, they are listed on his record when he is re-enlisted for the First World War. He actually has a very full service record.
He completed his colour service on 24/12/1902 and was in the Reserve until his discharge 9 Oct 1905, having completed his 12 year engagement.
Then when WW1 started he re-enlisted into the 17th Lancers with the number GS 10344 on 31 Aug 1914. He was immediately transferred to the 8th Reserve Cavalry Regiment (the 17th Lancers then being in India). On 3 March 1915 he was transferred again, this time to the RASC Remount Section. He remained in the UK (and possibly Ireland) throughout the war. One document in his record shows he was due to be posted to the Curragh, but in an application dated 3 March 1915 he asked to be transferred to the Remount Squadrons Depot at Romsey.  This permission was granted. During his RASC service at Romsey, he was promoted to acting Cook Sergeant on 12 May 1915. His RASC number was R/4/090530. He was finally discharged and transferred the Z reserve on 26 Sep 1919.

[Andy J2022]

Edward must have come back from South Africa ahead of the rest of the Regiment which didn't arrive back in the UK until the end of October 1902. They were then stationed in Edinburgh. Edward was discharged at Canterbury on 9 Oct 1902, which was probably the reason he came back early.
The 17th Lancers were stationed as follows:
        1891    England (whole regt)    
     1893    Preston    
   1895    Leeds    
     1897    Ireland: Ballincollig    
     1900.02.14    at sea    ship: Victorian
     1900.03.10    South Africa    3 Cav Bde
     1900.11    South Africa    unbrigaded
     1902.11    Scotland: Edinburgh    
     1905    India: Meerut    
     1909    Sialkot
        Nov 1914 France and Flanders

[RowanR]

Thank you very much Andy. I see Ballincollig is in Cork so I guess Harold Clifford found it easier to give Cork for his birth place and I guess that that was somewhere Florence could go with him, like she later went with him to Romsey, since Douglas Edward and my grandmother Majorie Hilda are born there in 1916 and 1919. I haven't managed to work through his WW1 service record yet so the information you mention about that is very interesting.

Do you have any ideas why he would have been at Fulford Barracks when he marries in April 1897 when it seems the unit was in Leeds, or why he would have come back to England during the middle of the Boer War (and I need to go reread that, I've just realised that period is not 235 days), or why he would have come home early to be discharged?

I'm sorry if these seem like silly questions but Edward is my only direct ancestor to have been in the military, so it's a whole new area to me.

[Andy J2022]

Not silly questions at all. Service records are fine for the big picture but they often miss out the detail. For example you will have seen on his character reference at the end of his first period of service that his performance was classed as 'Fair' and in the past he had been absent several times. However nowhere in his record do we find details of when he was absent. You may be able to deduce some of his lapses because he forfeits his good conduct pay.

Anyway, turning to your specific questions, I think it is possible that at least one squadron of the 17th Lancers might have been based at the Cavalry Barracks at Fulford in York. One of the roles of the light cavalry was to act in support of the police in the case of civil riotous behaviour, and so it was prudent to have smaller groups of cavalry dispersed around the country in the major towns. The locations I listed were taken from the 'Stations of the British Army' which were published each month in many English newspapers, and were of necessity somewhat abbreviated. The best place to check on Edward's whereabouts month by month would be in the muster rolls held at the National Archives. These go up 1897/8, but they have not been digitised, so it would need a personal visit to Kew to view them.
As for why he came back from South Africa in September 1900, there could be several reasons, perhaps the foremost being on compassionate grounds if his wife was seriously ill. I don't think it would have been for disciplinary reasons, because if he had been sentenced to any term of imprisonment this would have been deducted from his reckonable service (ie he would have had to serve for longer than 12 years) but this doesn't seem to have occurred. As for him coming home early to be discharged, that was quite normal. The situation in South Africa was much more stable following the Treaty of Vereeniging in late May 1902, and so the regiment was largely employed on garrison duties for the last couple of months. He had to come back to have his discharge medical and go through various administrative procedures before effectively leaving the Army (although he still had two years of reserve commitment left).
I see what you mean about the error in the number of days shown for him being at home in the middle period. Based on the dates it should read 172 days, not 237. On the other hand the figure of 146 days spent in S Africa is also wrong by the same amount, and should read 207 days, so it looks like a clerical error: perhaps 10/9/00 should read 10/7/00.

[RowanR]

That's interesting thank you. I'm glad you mentioned that he forfeited his good conduct pay I was wondering what PGC pay was. I've just noticed right at the front he signed on for 7 years with the colours and 5 with the reserve so I guess the Boer War extended his service with the colours and he got transferred to the Reserve as soon as possible for what was left of those 5 years.

I can't find an obvious reason for his return home in 1900, nothing like his parents or one of his children dying (although I don't actually know when either of his parents did die), although that doesn't exclude sickness, but he definitely seems to have met with Florence, because their daughter Evelyn was born in York on 17 May 1901.

I think that answers my main questions at the moment, I feel I have a rough understanding of what he was doing during his service now. Thank you for your help. I dare say I'll be back on this board soon though, I've got Edward's WW1 record to get through although you did explain some of that already, then it looks like at least 2 of his sons were in the RAF in the 1930s and into WW2, so I'll need to see what I can work out for them. Also I do have some collateral family who were in the army and I remembered after making my last post that my great grandfather James Henry Widdop was also briefly in the Army, between leaving his wife and going back to her, I never think of him as having been a soldier though.