Smith's help!

[wilcoxon]

Ernest Hesford is buried in Phillips Park Cemetery. A War grave by the looks of it. There are no  others in the same grave / plot.

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01u3o/

[wilcoxon]

On 2 June 1898 there was a serious train crash at Leyland, an excursion was returning from Blackpool.
One of the injured was Anne Burn 11 Willow Street Bradford.
No other names that I recognise.
Sheffield Daily Telegraph 4 June 1898

Ernest Hesford aged 19 of Chatham Street was on the same train, he injured his foot.

[Cas (stallc)]

On 2 June 1898 there was a serious train crash at Leyland, an excursion was returning from Blackpool.
One of the injured was Anne Burn 11 Willow Street Bradford.
No other names that I recognise.
Sheffield Daily Telegraph 4 June 1898

Ernest Hesford aged 19 of Chatham Street was on the same train, he injured his foot.

Could be the Ann Burn/s that married Ernest later in 1902. If so that is another connection, maybe she was looking after James McAndry/McAndrew after Honora/Ann nee Byrne died?

Added - not found James in 1901..possible death 1907..

[ManchesterJohnson]

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/176087856/john-william-smith

Not too sure about Anne Broughton, but it does seem to be a private plot as it has a headstone.

Looks like Anne Broughton is sister Ann/Annie

1939 register has her as Anne Broughton with the Holland family birth 24 Oct 1881

Is she the first born baptism Joanna b 24 Oct 1880 reply #57 given by John.. But called Ann?

Catherine Holland has a birth of 26 June 1883  not 26 Jan 1883.  Possible error transcript in bapt register? written plainly in 1939

1939 - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61596/records/26905783

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/141378736/benjamin-holland with wife Catherine

The Holland name is of definite interest to me. My dear old aunt Pauline Johnson, now 90, is convinced her mother, Catherine Cain treated a Florence Holland almost as a sister. She has no recollection of the actual relationship, but the fact that Hollands crop up in your reseach is interesting, as was the Broughton name.

You guys are really showing me how this is done, and it's going to take me a long time to sift through each of these posts!

[Cas (stallc)]

If all correct and confirmed via certs Catherine Cain & Florence Holland were cousins. Reply # 71 explains the possible family Broughton connection

[ManchesterJohnson]

I like all the research recently done and have no doubts that is the 3 children in 1891 census. my slight issue is that John W(1873 but baptised 1872) and Maggie (1875, or is her age incorrect and should be 26=1865 a per baptism. There is a very strong death in late 1871 Manchester for John aged 30 who was 30 in 1871 census.

SS

added, below birth a possible, date of birth different from baptism.
who was at that address in 1865 rate books and is it possibly the same address as 1864 marriage?

Trying to go through your research line by line - only up to reply 29 so far! This birth certificate threw me to be honest. The main consensus is John Smith m Mary Burns and had Margarita Smith in September 1865. The photo shows a Margaret Smith being born to John Smith and Mary Byrne at a different date.

Does this throw a spanner into the Burns Byrne conversations? I hope just a coincidence as the McAndry/McAndrews link is too good.

I have ordered the marriage certificate of James and Honora. I have also ordered the death certificate of John SMith d 1871, as that seems the likeliest.

[Cas (stallc)]

I cannot speak for SS, hopefully he will drop in to give his thoughts.

My thoughts are the first born Margarite baptism found by SS, reply # 1, died before 1875 as another Margaret was born illegitimate after the death of John Smith. James Burns (second husband, married 1879) maybe her father, but only Mary baptised her as Burns, (found by John, reply #51) But she used the surname Smith.

Up until 1875 registration was not enforced, but could be frowned upon by some officials, if the child was not registered. Many saw baptism as enough, as god was more important, Catholics in particular.

The cert very generously purchased by SS, is either another John Smith/Mary Byrne, or the priest/official was on their case and the birthdate was altered not to incur a fine maybe. (6 wks to register from birth)

Just my thoughts, but stand to be corrected.

[Cas (stallc)]

It was worth a try.

SS, a year older today

Apologies for going off thread....But just reread whole thread, and missed this...

Happy belated birthday for the 14th November SS 

[Cas (stallc)]

Also meant to add, if not aware, some birth & death certs are available as an instant digital download for £3.00 from GRO

Unfortunately marriages are not included