Anchor Mills Clark family.

[Forfarian]

AH! I think that's an error on the part of whoever did the FindAGrave write-up. 'Wright' is in italics, indicating that that, not Phil(i)p, is her maiden surname.

There is in the 1851 census in Hulme, Lancashire, a family consisting of Samuel Clark, 39, bricklayer, born Cheshire; wife Ann, 29; sons William, 9; and Richard, 5 months, all born Hulme.

Samuel Clark married Ann Wright in Manchester on 25 September 1838.

William, son of William Clarke, bricklayer, and Ann, maiden surname Wright, was born 6 December 1841. I have yet to find any record of Richard.

There are two possibles for Ann Wright in Hulme
- baptised 28 February 1819, parents William and Ellen
- born 12 August 1820, baptised 22 March 1822, Thomas and Ellen
but there could well be others whose baptisms are not recorded, or not readily available

I see that FindaGrave has Samuel Clark buried in Ararat General Cemetery, so obviously this couple must also have emigrated. Samuel's death index listing is unhelpful - it doesn't name either his parents or his wife. Maybe Ann Wright or Clark died and he emigrated as a widower?

I am in absolutely no doubt whatever that this couple has nothing whatsoever to do with Ann Phil(i)p or Clark(e). The information on the death certificate must trump the assumptions of the person who put the additional information in FindAGrave.

If you want to prove that Ann Wright or Clark is not Ann Phil(i)p or Clark, you could get a copy of the marriage certificate of Samuel Clark and Ann Wright and see what her father's name was. I will eat my hat if he was Andrew. 

You may also wish to consider asking for the information on FindAGrave to be corrected.

Does that make sense?

[osip]

Yes Forfarian that makes sense and after more reading over all the info available I agree 100% with you.

That death cert has been very helpful too with childrens ages and it provides us with a date of arrival in Australia.

And much credit to you as the cert also verifies all the info you gave me in earlier posts. Many thanks.

I'll post any more info I find.

[Forfarian]

You're welcome.

[osip]

A lot has been said about Robert Clark but I have a more general question regarding him.

According to dates Robert landed in Victoria Australia in 1871. Being born in 1810, and him now being 61 years old I was wondering - was there no age limit to immigration? Would he have had an income?And at 61 what could have attracted him to move there along with his wife?

[David Nicoll]

Hi,
   A very reasonable question, from my experience there was no upper age limit, people were travelling later in life as spouses died, farm leases ended etc.
   If we are right in identifying him as a marine engineer, he was a skilled worker and would have been much in demand. There was a lot of emigration at this time and there would be many Deeside relatives out there ahead of him, sending back information by letter or word of mouth.
   I have one relative who was back from Australia in Aberdeenshire in time to be present in the 1871 census before returning to Australia, and another who was a ships engineer on the Australia run, so lots of encouragement to go seek a better life.

[osip]

Hi David and thanks, you have some interesting research of your own I see. And Australian connections too.

The only occupation I have seen for Robert is a gas work labourer. The marine engineers of the family came later. Which seems to be the predominent occupation among men in other parts of my research too. Not surprising as most were of Liverpool origin.

That's a good point about other fellow countrymen being there who could offer advise or even accomodation. Even just within the Clark namesake there are plenty of established families.

I have no inkling of how scary such a venture must have been. But the attraction whatever it was must have outweighed any fears.

[David Nicoll]

Hi,

  A couple of thoughts there, in the 1861 census he was a gas works foreman, not a labourer. So the skill thing would still be valid. I see that gas lighting was expanding in Sydney and also Melbourne, so opportunities there.
  The other is if correct he died of TB? So a possible move for his health?
  You can make up lots of stories! Who knows one might even be right.

[osip]

Yes you can make up lots of stories and here’s mine.

I like better the fact that Robert was a foreman and not a labourer as it shows he had managerial skills. And that fits better with my meshed list of facts below basically trying to match Roberts father James with James II.  I’m expecting holes to be picked in it but I just thought I’d try.

James Clark was born in 1747 and started the business. He started making cotton thread in 1813  and, together with his son James (II)(1782-1865), built a mill at Seedhill, Paisley, Renfrewshire, Scotland.

1810 Our Robert Clark is born (father James mother Janet Morris)

This mill was acquired in 1819 by James Clark II and his brother John, who formed J & J Clark, thread manufacturers, Paisley, Renfrewshire, Scotland.

1851 Robert is a gas works foreman.

1854 James and Robert (sons of James Clark II  Could this James II be married to Janet Morris making this Robert our Robert?) establish the business J&R Clark.

Robert and Ann were in Leith by 1854, when their daughter Betsey was born.

In 1859 the business moved to the Burnside Mill on the south bank of the river cart.   

In 1861 Robert and Ann are in South Leith.

In 1871 Robert with or without Ann is in Australia.

[Forfarian]

James Clark (1782-1865) died in Paisley Abbey district, mother's maiden surname Campbell. His death certificate says that he was the widower of Agnes McFarlane, and his parents were James Clark and Margaret Campbell.

James Clark 1782-1865 and Agnes McFarlane were married in Paisley in 1830, and they did indeed have a son Robert; he was baptised in Paisley on 24 March 1833. He would have been just 7 years old when your Robert Clark married Ann Phil*p* in 1830.

According to a newspaper article in 1878, "The members and sole partners of the firm of Clark and Co are James, John, Stewart and William Clark. The family has been connected .... with the manufacture of sewing cotton since its introduction at the beginning of this century, and .... as far back as 1720 were engaged in the manufacture of linen thread ....".

Stewart Clark died on 20 November 1907 aged 77. According to the deaths index his mother's maiden name was Aitken. John Clark, mother's maiden name Aitken, died at Gateside, Paisley in 1894 aged 66. Newspaper obituaries confirm that these were the John and Stewart Clark of the thread manufacturing company.

John Clark and Elisabeth Aitken were married in Paisley in 1819. Inconveniently, the threadmill Clarks seem to have belonged to one of the dissenting churches, and there are just two baptisms of their children readily available: Elisabeth in 1820 and James in 1821. However there is a Clark family  at Gateside, Paisley, in the 1841 census consisting of John, 45; Eliza; 40; Elisabeth, 20; James, 19; Margaret, 15; John, 14; Stewart, 11; Anna, 8; Jane, 6; Robert, 5; Alexander, 3; and William, 3 months.

In 1851, at Gateside, Paisley, are John Clark, 58, thread manufacturer, born Paisley; wife Elizabeth, 55; children George, 27; John, 23; Stewart, 21; Annabella, 19; Jane, 17; Robert R, 15; Alexander, 13.

From this I deduce that the four thread mill Clark brothers were the family of John, not James, Clark.

Turning to Aberdeenshire, James Clark and Janet Morice had at least five of a family: Margaret, 1801; James, 1803; Andrew, 1808; Robert, 1810; Helen, 1813. This means that their father James must have been born before 1786, as a boy could not legally marry until he was 14. The chances are that he was a good ten years older than that, born around 1770.

Andrew Clark, born Crathy, agricultural labourer, was in Rescobie, Angus in 1851 with a wife and family, and Andrew Clark, 57, mother's surname Morris, died in Murroes, Angus, in 1865. His death certificate confirms that his parents were James Clark, labourer, and Janet Morris, and his death was registered by his brother Robert.

So none of the detail fits.

I also think it's rather unlikely that James Clark, son of a thread manufacturer in Paisley, would move to the remotest corner of Aberdeenshire, marry there before he was 18, earn a living as a labourer for a few years, return to the fold in Paisley by 1830, marry again there and start a new family.