Author Topic: A real conundrum  (Read 1692 times)

Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 10:25 BST (UK) »

Baptism Shepshed 12 May 1732 Elizabeth daur of John ALT Carr-Lam & Eliz his wife. [maybe this girl was married to a KEIGHTLEY then widowed.] Or it was a clerical error by the vicar and when she got married he put her name down wrong. She did not sign her name when she married.

PS - Baptism at Shepshed 12 Aug 1737 George son of John ALT and Mary his wife.

There is a burial in 1815 for an Elizabeth Alt, age indicates a birth about 1733. Could be her if she never married. Can't find an alternative marriage for an Elizabeth Alt in Shepshed. But if George Allt   (the witness) is a relative, wouldn't he notice the name was wrong. Unless he could sign his name but not read.
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott

Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 10:49 BST (UK) »
Just found a will for a Mary Keightley (single woman of Shepshed) made in 1803, proved in 1806. She mentions her niece Elizabeth Potter, nephews Richard and Joseph Potter, niece Mary Mowbray (wife of John Mowbray) and niece Hannah Hanford (wife of John Hanford).

Where does Auntie Mary fit in?
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott

Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 10:55 BST (UK) »
There's a burial of a May Keightly in Shepshed on 30 Jan 1803 age 80 (birth abt 1733) - about three weeks after the will was written. Wonder why probate took so long.
Her age would make her a likely sister for the Elizabeth who married Richard Potter and hence aunt to Richard and Elizabeth's children.
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott

Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 11:08 BST (UK) »
John Mowbray married Mary Potter on 16 Feb 1790 in Shepshed, witnesses Thomas Mowbray and William Lester.

John Hanford married Hannah Potter on 07 Jul 1801 in Shepshed.
Hannah baptised on 01 Jul 1776 d/o Richard and Elizabeth

Haven't checked the other Potter children yet, but assuming they are all Hannah's siblings, we have 5 of the 9 children of Richard and Elizabeth.
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott


Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 11:23 BST (UK) »
Just looked at will again, also mentioned niece Jane Burn (wife of Thomas Burn), they married on 28 Jan 1800. So that accounts for all R and E's children who outlived Auntie Mary.
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott

Offline LizzieL

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 11:45 BST (UK) »
I can't find baptisms for Elizabeth (later Potter) and Mary, but I wonder if they were the children of Joseph Keightly and Mary Ball who married by lic on 19 Oct 1731. he was 28 ( b abt 1703) and she was 23. Joseph made a will in 1739 which was proved 1740, mentions wife Mary and children (but does not name children) . The early death would account for only two children. He makes his wife sole executrix, he names two friends as trustees and mentions the bringing up of his children implying they are quite young
Berks / Oxon: Eltham, Annetts, Wiltshire (surname not county), Hawkins, Pembroke, Partridge
Dorset / Hants: Derham, Stride, Purkiss, Sibley
Yorkshire: Pottage, Carr, Blackburn, Depledge
Sussex: Goodyer, Christopher, Trevatt
Lanark: Scott (soldier went to Jersey CI)
Jersey: Fowler, Huelin, Scott

Offline PatLac

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 15 October 25 13:13 BST (UK) »
Great find LizzieL! Given that Elizabeth and Robert Potter's first child was named Joseph it's very possible that she was Joseph's daughter.

According to this tree on FS, Joseph and Mary had a son Joseph born in 1733 but baptised only in 1747

https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/person/details/LVNT-VWS


And there is this Mary Keightly

https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/person/details/MX42-S7R


Offline Spelk

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 16 October 25 17:27 BST (UK) »
Baptism at Shepshed 2 Jun 1730 Mary KEIGHTLY parents not given. The PR image does not show this baptism. So where from? BT maybe. Looking on Ancestry it references FHL film no. 595770. Note this baptism would be over a year before Joseph and Mary got married in the Anglican Church I Oct 1731.

Baptism at Shepshed 26 Dec 1747 Joseph son of Joseph KEIGHTLY & Mary his wife Aged 14 yrs. [so born abt 1733.] [The age at death for Mary also has her being born about 1733]

Possible son of Mary
Baptism at Shepshed 19 Oct 1751 John son of Mary KEIGHTLEY. Image of PR.
? Burial at Shepshed 14 Jun 1791 John KEIGHTLEY Aged 38 years.

I can find no sign of a baptism for Elizabeth.

The Will of Joseph mentions his children but not how many they were. Could have been 5 in the time they had.

The only one who we can find a baptism for is son Joseph when he was age 14.
Were they Catholics, Quakers or Jews?
The Will of Joseph indicates he was conventional CofE so was his wife different or did they try being Quaker and later gave it up?
Did they move somewhere after marriage and then come back. Not likely as Joseph described himself as Yeoman and farmers who owned land tend to stay put.

As the name KEIGHTLEY was quite common might Joseph be commonly referred to with some nickname or alias? Possible and then when son Joseph came to be age 14 and maybe wanted to be apprenticed he had to be baptised in his real name. Or was this baptism just so he could prove he had settlement rights in Shepshed.

Offline PatLac

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Re: A real conundrum
« Reply #17 on: Friday 17 October 25 22:24 BST (UK) »
One certain thing is that the OP's ancestor was Elizabeth Keightley who married Robert Potter, because John Mowbray who married her daughter Mary Potter had a sister, Mary Mowbray, who married George James Ward in 1803 in Shepshed (OP has posted about the Ward branch of her family), unless one of the descendants of Elizabeth Orringe (nee Keightley) has married a cousin  ;D