Author Topic: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)  (Read 1131 times)

Offline Biggles50

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #9 on: Friday 03 October 25 13:34 BST (UK) »
Researching genealogy one can have all the paper trails that exist.

However only if it is validated by DNA can one take the lineage as being correct.

From Grandfather to Grandson there may not even be a paper trail.

I know that for a 100% true fact. 

I have no documentary trail to my Grandfather but DNA has given me links to him via my Half Sister.

DNA works.

Offline rathmore

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #10 on: Friday 03 October 25 13:43 BST (UK) »
have you looked on find my past

http://www.findmypast.co.uk

marriage of Thomas and Bertha

also record of Thomas death and copy of his signing up 26th Australian Infantry Battalion service no. 126


Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #11 on: Friday 03 October 25 14:25 BST (UK) »


marriage of Thomas and Bertha


Quote
Thomas died Oct 1917, World War I. The year before he married Bertha Ellen Lenton....

FreeBMD https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Marriage Apr-Jun 1917   
Lenton    Bertha E    McGregor    Wandsworth    1d   1131
McGregor    Thomas    Lenton    Wandsworth    1d   1131


Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo

Offline Neale1961

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 04 October 25 03:14 BST (UK) »
I'm with the Familysearch tree.
His enlistment papers say he is 27 and 11m9onths in April 1915 so birth May 1887.
School records for Woolmore St Scholl  Poplar 20.1.1891
Thomas Mcgregor born 2.5.1887  s of thomas 19 Grove Villa former school Glengall Road.
It fits for the 1891 entry Grove Villsa
Thomas 39 blacksmith Scotland
Kate 34 Scotland
James 12
John 10 Scotland
Maggie 7 Poplar
Thomas 3
Kate 1

Kate's GRO says mother McDougall.

Looking at the tree on Familysearch, Thomas’s parents are shown as Thomas McGregor and Catherine McDougal. Scotlandspeople has a marriage for that couple in Govan, Glasgow in 1878. It also has the birth of a son John 9th July 1880 to them in Govan at Kensington Terrace, Paisley Rd Govan, Glasgow. Father Thomas was a journeyman mason. Don’t see a birth in Scotland for Thomas junior c 1886. I think that's because he was born in London.

1991 census for Grove Villas, Poplar, London lists Thomas 39, Kate 34, James 12, John 10, Maggie 7, Thomas 3 & Kate 1. Last 3 all born London, the others in Scotland.

I am sorry, but I very much doubt the accuracy of the Familysearch Tree quoted above.
The family appear to have NO connection at all with Greenock or Renfrewshire.
The son from that family, Thomas McGrgeor born 1887 in Cubitt Town was in the Mercantile Marine. See attached record.

It is really important to see the marriage record for Thomas and Bertha to get as much correct information as possible. See my reply #5.
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland & New York)


Offline SearchingforThomas

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 04 October 25 05:30 BST (UK) »
Hi there and welcome to Rootschat!

Did he marry in Queensland? If so can you provide all the information from his marriage certificate?
I would expect a marriage in Queensland to show his parents' names.

Hi Jorose, Thomas was married in England. To Bertha Lenton in 1916.

Offline SearchingforThomas

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 04 October 25 08:22 BST (UK) »
There is a tree on Family search site that might help ??? ???

https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/pedigree/landscape/LDMX-5N5

Sorry if this your tree  ;D

Dear GC1, Thanks for your input.  I have checked the family tree out and while there are some elements in the tree that correlate to my Ancestry.com family tree.  I was not the author of the tree and certainly have not ever come across any information for a James McGregor and Catherine Mc Dougall in previous searches. I will certainly take a further look at it and see if I can validate the information. Thank you

Offline SearchingforThomas

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 04 October 25 09:32 BST (UK) »
Updated NOK on WW 1 record says
Aunt - Mrs LENTON, 18 Falcom Grove, Battersea.

Lots of crossings out and address is changed to
50 Northcote Estate, Papanui, Christchurch, NZ.
His memorial scroll and plaque were sent to that address, which was also where his widow resided.

Hi Neal1961 Thank you for pointing out Thomas's War records. Yes, there is a lot of crossing out. The Papanui address is the address of my great grandmother (Thomas wife Bertha) once she immigrated to NZ with my grandfather (also Thomas).

Offline Neale1961

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Re: Brick wall — Thomas McGregor (b. Greenock c.1886)
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 05 October 25 02:49 BST (UK) »
Tom McGregor married in 1917 Wandsworth to Bertha Ellen Lenton.
You need to see the marriage certificate for his father’s name and occupation.
Do You have that record?

Since you haven’t answered this question, we assume you need to acquire the marriage record for the information it should provide about his father.
Once you have it, it might be possible to help with additional information.

Some general thoughts and observances:-

•   Trying to find his brother John McGregor through the army will be tough. It is such a common name in Scotland, and John may have moved from one regiment to another, which was fairly typical. The majority of British WW1 records were destroyed in WW2 bombing.

•   From Thomas McGregor’s WW1 military papers we know that he was a labourer, and probably had limited ability to read or write. This is worth remembering when looking for passenger lists or census records. His family background would probably be the same.

•   I would not take the age on Thomas’ military papers as necessarily accurate. In my experience, ages were often altered. Younger men put their age up, and older men put their age down in order to meet criteria. The photo of Thomas in his WW1 uniform (attached to the public tree) could quite easily be a man in his 30s, not his 20s.

•   His WW1 papers also include several enquiries about his wellbeing from Mrs. A. M Sheridan, and her daughter. It is obvious they were dear friends, but I could not see a family connection. James Sheridan (1869 -1925) married Annie May Day (1869-1958) in 1892 in QLD. James Sheridan was a labourer and appears to have worked away from home for the railway, while his wife and 2 children were based in Rockhampton from about 1912-1922. It looks as if Thomas McGregor was a close friend of the Sheridan family and possibly a co-worker of James on the railway. The construction of the railway in central Queensland at this time employed a large number of labourers over many years.

•   As you are aware, McGregor is a very common name in Scotland. However it is possible that your Thomas was born with a different surname, either illegitimate or his mother remarried and the surname changed. McGregor may not necessarily have been the name that he came to Australia under.
Milligan - Jardine – Glencross – Dinwoodie - Brown: (Dumfriesshire & Kirkcudbrightshire)
Clark – Faulds – Cuthbertson – Bryson – Wilson: (Ayrshire & Renfrewshire)
Neale – Cater – Kinder - Harrison: (Warwickshire & Queensland)
Roberts - Spry: (Cornwall, Middlesex & Queensland)
Munster: (Schleswig-Holstein & Queensland) and Plate: (Braunschweig, Neubruck & Queensland & New York)