Episcopal Holy Trinity Church, Paisley records for my family

[hannahjgervaise]

Hi,

I have seen that the Glasgow City Archives section of the Mitchell Library hold the Holy Trinity Paisley registers 1817- 1984 and minutes for 1839- 1973. As I live in Australia and can't easily come myself is there anyone doing research there who could check for mention of my Irwin family for the 1839 - 1851 period?. They were :
William (George?) Irwin/Irvine, a School Master
Jane nee Erskine Irwin
Their children:
Jane
Olivia Mary Smith Irwin
Sussannah Irwin
William Erskine Irwin
Cecilia Irwin(my g.g. grandmother)
There may have been other children I do not know about so it would be appreciated if someone could check Baptisms and Burials/Deaths in the registers and there may be some mentions in the minutes as William probably taught at the Episcopal School.
I can do some research if needed in exchange re Scottish emigrants to Australia.

[Neale1961]

Baptisms at Port Glasgow
Children of William Irvine and Jean Erskine

•   Ann IRVINE 27/08/1820
•   Robert Henry Hart IRVINE 07/03/1824
•   Margaret Anne IRVINE  10/01/1827
(all available on Scotlands People)

Since William Irvine and Jane Erskine married in May 1819 in Port Glasgow, that baptism for Ann in 1820 might be their first child.


1841 census Irwin family
https://www.freecen.org.uk/search_records/5a154c02f4040b9d6e5e3ee5/olivia-irwin-1841-renfrewshire-paisley-1830-?locale=en

1851 census Irwin girls
https://www.freecen.org.uk/search_records/5a14fd57f4040b9d6e06cfbf/susanna-irwin-1851-lanarkshire-old-monkland-1837-?locale=en

[hannahjgervaise]

Thanks for replying but they are not my Irwins/Irvines. Mine did have a child at Port Glasgow in 1826 (Jane) so they could not have another in January the next year. Also Sussannah was said to be the third daughter and would not be if there was another daughter born. The William you mention was a Labourer but mine was a School Master. Another reason why I don't think this is my family is that they probably were not Episcopal like mine if Scotland's People have the record as most Episcopal records are in private hands. Some of my family have this couple as being ours but I think that it is because they cannot find a Marriage record or Jane's Jnrs. Baptism.I think the family you mentioned did not move to Greenock or Paisley either but I could check that out.

[Neale1961]

Some things to bear in mind as you continue your search….. 

Dates of baptisms are NOT dates of birth.

You don’t know what a record contains by looking at the index.

The 1851 census shows all of your family were born in Port Glasgow, not Paisley.

How do you know Jane was born in 1826 if you have no birth record?

Where does information about Susannah being 3rd daughter come from, and how do you know it is correct?

When did the father William begin work as a school master, and what did he do before that?

Good luck.

[Forfarian]

Sussannah was said to be the third daughter and would not be if there was another daughter born.

Unless one daughter born before Susannah had died in very early infancy and they didn't count her.

Also, where was daughter Jane in 1841?

The William you mention was a Labourer but mine was a School Master.

The one in the 1841 census is a schoolmaster.

Another reason why I don't think this is my family is that they probably were not Episcopal like mine if Scotland's People have the record as most Episcopal records are in private hands.

The fact that there was an episcopalian baptism does not preclude it also being recorded in the Church of Scotland registers because the C of S was supposed to keep a record of all baptisms, not just its own. This didn't always - or even often - happen, but it isn't unusual to find baptisms of other denominations in the C of S records. It depends on how diligent the session clerk was, and in some cases on the non-C-of-S parents reporting the baptism.

[Neale1961]

Also, where was daughter Jane in 1841?

Possibly here?
https://www.freecen.org.uk/search_records/5a154a46f4040b9d6e5c4b94/jean-irwin-1841-renfrewshire-greenock-1826-?locale=en

[hannahjgervaise]

Neale61, I don't think that the Jean Irwin you found working as a servant is my Jane. I think that even at 15 she would have been the teacher or dressmaker that she was later. I saw a Miss Irvine listed as a teacher in the period in a Postal Directory but cannot tell if it was her. She may have been visiting or working in her father's birthplace of Ireland at the time of the census.

I really need to see the Paisley Holy Trinity Registers  and Minutes that are in the Glasgow City Archives at the Mitchell Library or what the local studies library and Heritage centre at Paisley Central Library have. There is a register at the Church itself but there are some missing records. I can't easily travel to Scotland though from Australia.

[Forfarian]

You might need to hire a professional searcher.

See https://asgra.co.uk/

[hannahjgervaise]

Forfarian,  Thanks for the recommendation. I try to get as much for free as I can ( the Scottish stereotype - I have a lot of Scottish ancestors on my paternal side and I don't see that as a character flaw). There is not much chance for anything to be found of use but I may be tempted to in the future.
I was hoping that an Erskine related dna match of mine would look at some records held at the Paisley Central Library and she said that she would but she has not read my messages lately so I could possibly get the researcher to look there as well as it is not far from Glasgow. As much as I would like to look myself it is a bit expensive and far away for me to go to Scotland again from Australia.