Is the bigger always a better place to live? Magna, Super, Higher, Greater

[elliot]

Is the bigger, always a better place to live?  Magna, Super, Higher, Greater  etc....
 
Have they always been the superior and self-aggrandizing sibling just bullying and trampling over the  little siblings?  Did the pecking-order ever get reversed and overthrown when Little became Big?
 

[BumbleB]

Rubbish!

[KGarrad]

So, I looked up Chew Magna, North Somerset.

Lay and religious holdings formed an episcopal property held, as overlord, by Giso, the last Saxon bishop and the name Magna comes from the Latin meaning 'the greater'. This is supported by the Domesday Book which was made to specify the 1086 and the pre-conquest holder, in both instances given as the "Bishop of Wells". Hence its benefice was from the early medieval period converted from a rectory to a vicarage, with substantial tythings adjoining named Bishop Sutton, Knowle with Knighton Sutton, North Elm, and Stone. Furthermore, it had the living of Dundry annexed to it.

Since about 1600, the name changed to Chew Magna as this has been the most important of the several villages along the banks of the River Chew and reflecting the reduced wealth of the established church from the Dissolution of the Monasteries onwards.


Then I looked up Weston-super-Mare, also in North Somerset.

Super mare is Latin for "upon the sea" and was added to distinguish it from the many other settlements named Weston in the Diocese of Bath and Wells.


Higher usually means up a hill, as compared to Lower being in a valley.



So, I agree with BB!

[LizzieL]

I thought it was just a way of distinguishing between two neighbouring villages with the same name, by size or by whether they were at the top of the hill (upper) or in the valley (lower). Alternatively geography is often used: east/ west, north/ south.
In what was Berkshire, there are two villages, East and West Challow. On 1861 census a relative of mine born in West Challow, recorded he was born in Little Challow. (He had by then moved out of the village). I have not seen it called that on maps, but it may have been known as that locally because it was the smaller of the two Challows. Would the locals use a detrimental description of their own village if that wasn't its official name?

[MollyC]

Near Rotherham are Dalton Magna and Dalton Parva, however older documents refer to them as Great Dalton and Little Dalton, so using the Latin suffixes seems to be a bit of 18th cent. superiority.  They were in different parishes, Rotherham and Thrybergh, with areas of 1024 and 389 acres, but their boundaries were much intertwined.  On the 6-inch OS map of 1851 they were one township, but Dalton did not become a separate Ecclesiastical Parish until 1869.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=13.0&lat=53.46121&lon=-1.33114&layers=257&b=ESRIWorld&o=100

The division probably dates back to Anglo-Saxon times because Domesday says parts of Dalton were owned by:
[King] Harold, then by William de Warrenne
Northmann, then by William de Percy
William de Percy also owned Thrybergh, so he seems to have held Little Dalton.

(Note: The NLS site seems to have developed an irritating habit of reopening the info. panels on the LH side every time you zoom or click & drag.  I have just emailed them about it.)

[KGarrad]

Near Rotherham are Dalton Magna and Dalton Parva, however older documents refer to them as Great Dalton and Little Dalton, so using the Latin suffixes seems to be a bit of 18th cent. superiority.  They were in different parishes, Rotherham and Thrybergh, with areas of 1024 and 389 acres, but their boundaries were much intertwined.  On the 6-inch OS map of 1851 they were one township, but Dalton did not become a separate Ecclesiastical Parish until 1869.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=13.0&lat=53.46121&lon=-1.33114&layers=257&b=ESRIWorld&o=100

The division probably dates back to Anglo-Saxon times because Domesday says parts of Dalton were owned by:
[King] Harold, then William de Warrenne
Northmann, then William de Percy
William de Percy also owned Thrybergh, so he seems to have held Little Dalton.

The civil parish of Dalton includes the communities of Brecks, Dalton Brook, Dalton Foljambe, Dalton Magna, Dalton Parva, Flanderwell, Sunnyside and Woodlaithes.
So, 4 Daltons!

[MollyC]

Yes, the civil parish was the successor to the township.  There is also an enclosure award for the whole, dated 1800: 500 acres of common fields and waste, so clearly the agriculture was integrated.  The other places were not substantial until later.

Dalton Brook is the low-lying area to the west, alongside the Rotherham-Doncaster turnpike road which had only the Grapes Inn and a windmill until it was filled with colliery housing in the early 20th cent.  I have never seen Foljambe on a map, he was a major landowner, probably in the Thrybergh part.  The other three places are connected with a detached piece of Dalton Magna to the east where you can see Flanderwell and Woodlaithes Farms, and also detached pieces of Conisbrough township and parish.  Landscape history suggests these areas were a woodland resource which became divided in Anglo-Saxon times.  (Conisbrough Castle was the seat of King Harold then William de Warenne.)  Sunnyside is 20th cent. colliery housing, not on this edition.

ADDED I forgot Brecks.  SW corner of Dalton, at the junction with Whiston and Wickersley parishes.  Brecks House on the turnpike and Brecks Hill.  Brecks is a woodland clearance place-name
There is a Dalton Foljambe primary school, on Foljambe Drive, 20th cent., probably 1954.
http://archives.rotherham.gov.uk/CalmView/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=77-E6&pos=30

[Jebber]

Rubbish!

I agreed.

[MollyC]

Quote   "Did the pecking-order ever get reversed and overthrown when Little became Big?"

Well yes, because Dalton Parva was swamped with housing, then partially redeveloped, whereas Dalton Magna remains a relatively small village.  Take your pick where you would rather be.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=15.0&lat=53.43768&lon=-1.31061&layers=193&b=ESRIWorld&o=10

http://archives.rotherham.gov.uk/CalmView/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=63-B%2f6%2f21%2f11
(The named streets are at Dalton Brook not Thrybergh.)