Thomas Davies 1855

[NorthernGeezer]

Neale1961
Firstly, thanks for the quick response, I'll answer the questions seperately as I get to them rather than do it en block, this has proven to be a complicated search.

Yes, that is the correct previous thread in your reply #1

You are also correct, James Davies on the marriage certificate of Thomas and Sarah in 1876 is a Cooper, on my grandfathers marriage certificate, Thomas's son with Cecilia, in 1930 its listed as farmer.
I too was convinced by the Cooper link but its been pointed out to me  by another person researching the same family that the Thomas Davies born in Burghill in 1854 is NOT the same person as the Thomas Davies born in Holmer.
Another fact pointed out is by this person is that her Thomas Davies born in Burghill is married to a Mary Saunders, the Holmer Thomas was married twice, Sarah Tremble and Cecilia Ashton/Wildbore.

I believe everything after the 1876 marriage to Sarah is correct, the 1881 census has him in St Helens with his place of birth as Holmer not Burghill, the 1891 census physically has him Holmer with his new wife Cecilia and everything after that up to his death in Hereford in 1922 ties in too.

I now believe that the fact there is a Thomas and James Davies in Burghill who are both Coopers is just pure coincidence, the Mary Saunders marriage has convinced me of that.

[NorthernGeezer]

CaroleW
I believe the 1881 census is correct.
At this point in time I know nothing about Holmer Thomas, I was convinced Burghill Thomas was the right man.
I believe the 1876 marriage to Sarah is also correct, this means that at some point between his birth in 1855 and the marriage he himself moved to St Helens or James the father took the whole family.
I'm also happy that the 1891 census which has him back in Holmer with Cecilia is also correct.

[NorthernGeezer]

Neale1961
I agree completely with your posts at #3 and #4 for the Thomas born in Burghill, its what I had all along till the Holmer fact raised its head and the marriage to Mary Saunders.
The occupation farmer of James Davies on my grandads wedding certificate raised questions too, however, I accept that they could be one and the same, given the short distance between villages and whilst I havent checked the census records for Burghill Thomas after 1891 I'll get in touch with the other person and ask her the question.

[NorthernGeezer]

CaroleW
Sarah Yardley is a new one on me.
I have the marriage certificate of Sarah Tremble, widow, to Thomas Davies, cooper not collier in 1876.
I also have the the 1881 census showing Thomas as a sheet glass maker born in Holmer and William age 9 born in Haydock.
Further research has found that Sarah Makin married a John Tremble in 1870, the son William born a year later.
John Tremble died in 1872, the 1776 marriage of Sarah to Thomas shows her surname as Tremble.
Both Emily age 4 and Sarah age 1 are listed on my 1881 census as born in St Helens.
William is also listed on this census age 9 with the surname Davies.

My grandfather, Thomas James Davis was born in Holmer in 1888, this would have been following the move from St Helens back to Herefordshire, Holmer Thomas married Cecilia Ashton/Wildbore in 1885 in Prescott so the move back to Holmer must have been after this date.
Grandad married Elsie Bell in 1930 in Salford.

[Neale1961]

Thomas Davies born 1855 Burghill married Matilda Mary Saunders in 1880.
His father was Thomas, a labourer and thatcher.
His mother was Mary BRACE.

Have you thoroughly checked the other person’s claim, through documented evidence and sources?

Are you aware that there are 2 Thomas Davies born about 1 years apart in the same area. One is the son of James ,and the other is the son of Thomas.


You still appear confused about the 1930 marriage, and who was married and who was his father.

[NorthernGeezer]

Neale1961
The relative of Burghill Thomas is actually a professional genealogist who works at the Herefordshire County Council archives so I'm pretty sure she'll be pretty sure of her facts.

In my recent search two names came up as potential mothers to Holmer Thomas, a Sophia Seymour and an Alice Atkins.
Looking back at last years posts, Ladyhawk came up with two potential mothers also, Thomas Davies, born September 1855, Hereford, MMN Brace, GRO 6a/402, also June 1856, MMN Preece, GRO 6a/431.

1930 wedding, I have the certificate, Thomas James Davis ( my grandfather) married Elsie Jane Bell on 26th December, father listed as Thomas Davis, deceased, occupation listed as farmer.
I would hazard a guess that my grandad was named after his father with a middle name after his grandfather.
Forget about the no letter ';E' in Davis, the family story is he had a falling out with his family and dropped that letter from our surname.

Also, your reply at  #8 is correct, whilst the story proved inaccurate, Thomas met Cecilia in St Helens, not the other way round, the evidence is correct.

[Neale1961]

Have you thoroughly checked the other person’s claim, through documented evidence and sources?

Please post the supporting documents or links to the  sources.

[NorthernGeezer]

Neale1961
I'll ask her if she'll share what she's got.

[Neale1961]

I now believe that the fact there is a Thomas and James Davies in Burghill who are both Coopers is just pure coincidence, the Mary Saunders marriage has convinced me of that.

But you haven’t seen the that marriage certificate to know what is recorded. So how do you know?

Working from here-say and assumptions is not effective. You need FACTS.

The occupation farmer of James Davies on my grandads wedding certificate raised questions too,

James Davies occupation is NOT a farmer on any wedding certificate. You keep saying you are looking for James, a farmer. WHY?!

In your words (reply 14):-
“1930 wedding, I have the certificate, Thomas James Davis ( my grandfather) married Elsie Jane Bell on 26th December, father listed as Thomas Davis, deceased, occupation listed as farmer.”