Author Topic: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record  (Read 462 times)

Offline Clemans

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Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« on: Sunday 08 June 25 03:30 BST (UK) »
Can anyone help?

I am trying to decipher the word in the 6th column of the attached 1833 tithe record.
The word is a description of the quality of the land.

Thanks in advance

Clemans


Offline Calleva

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 08 June 25 05:02 BST (UK) »
I think the wording ‘Ara & pas’ is short hand for type rather than quality of the land;

Arable and pasture.
Patton Antrim, Stockton on Tees
Smith Elgin, Skye of Curr, Speyside
Cumming Speyside
McQueen Speyside
Gentleman Hawick
McPhee Lanarkshire

Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 08 June 25 07:10 BST (UK) »

The titheable land indicates Quality of the land.

Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo

Offline Calleva

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 08 June 25 10:28 BST (UK) »
Thanks Kiltaglassan,

The quality of the different parcels of land was indeed considered in order to provide valuations for tithes at the time but suggest the wording in the snippet Clemans provided is an abbreviation for arable and pasture. My understanding is that the quality itself was appraised from 1 to 4.

Grateful to be put right if I have the wrong end of the stick!

In any event the records are a wonderful source of information.

http://www.titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/home.jsp
Patton Antrim, Stockton on Tees
Smith Elgin, Skye of Curr, Speyside
Cumming Speyside
McQueen Speyside
Gentleman Hawick
McPhee Lanarkshire


Offline Clemans

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #4 on: Monday 09 June 25 03:55 BST (UK) »
Thanks one and all!

I suspect we are all a little bit right.

I have attached the full document I have, which clearly has Arable and Pasture under the heading "Quality" of the land.  I have read elsewhere that the use of 1, 2, 3 etc. to denote the quality was the norm, with some areas deviating from this - clearly this is one of them.

Does someone know the key to the 1, 2, 3 system, perhaps 1 = pasture or some such thing?

Thanks Clemans


Online Wexflyer

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #5 on: Monday 09 June 25 05:02 BST (UK) »
While the tythe valuations could use a numerical ranking for the quality of the land, such as 1-4, this was not universal. It is also common to see the quality assessed in simpler fashion - e.g. was it suitable for cultivation (arable) or pasture? Versus, say, bog, waste, or mountain.
BRENNANx2 Davidstown&Taghmon,Ballybrennan; COOPER St.Helens;CREAN Raheennaskeagh&Ballywalter;COSGRAVE Castlebridge?;CULLEN Lady's Island;CULLETON Forth Commons;CURRAN Hillbrook, Wic;DOYLE Clonee&Tombrack;FOX Knockbrandon; FURLONG Moortown;HAYESx2 Walsheslough&Wex;McGILL Litter;MORRIS Forth Commons;PIERCE Ladys Island;POTTS Bennettstown;REDMOND Gerry; ROCHEx2 Wex; ROCHFORD Ballysampson&Ballyhit;SHERIDAN Moneydurtlow; SINNOTT Wex;SMYTH Gerry&Oulart;WALSH Kilrane&Wex; WHITE Tagoat area

Online MollyC

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #6 on: Monday 09 June 25 07:42 BST (UK) »
I agree with Wexflyer that this could be a somewhat muddled assessment, without a scientific basis.  I don't know about Ireland, but in GB there is now a difference between Land Utilisation and Land Use Capability which emerged during the 20th cent. ‌in sets of maps overprinted on OS base maps.  In the 19th cent. the difference was probably somewhat subjective.

Quality of Land implies Land Use Capability, i.e. what the land could be used for, rather than what it is actually being used for, which would be affected by agricultural markets.  In the UK during the inter-war depression large areas of arable land were "put down to grass" i.e. pasture, which was reversed by the "plough-up campaign" at the beginning of WW2.

In enclosure awards the lawyers typically use as many words as possible saying "commons, moors, heaths and wastes".  I am uncertain what they actually mean by these words, but I suspect they were recognised by the types of natural vegetation growing there, determined by soil-type and drainage.  The word "moor" was widely used in lowland areas, and still persists in place-names.  At enclosure, thousands of acres were drained, ploughed and turned into arable, though probably not of the best quality.

Offline shanreagh

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 10 June 25 10:53 BST (UK) »
While the tythe valuations could use a numerical ranking for the quality of the land, such as 1-4, this was not universal. It is also common to see the quality assessed in simpler fashion - e.g. was it suitable for cultivation (arable) or pasture? Versus, say, bog, waste, or mountain.

I have actually never seen the references being numerical so would agree with Wexflyer that this may not have been universal. 

I randomly searched for an entry in Armagh and this is linked. From this you can see arable and bog
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ttb/

In simple land use terms arable land is usually of higher quality than pasture as arable land was suitable by soil type and geography for sustaining cropping. 

Other entries I have seen have 'rock', or 'mountain'. 

Online MollyC

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Re: Interpreting an Irish Tithe Record
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 10 June 25 14:26 BST (UK) »
The example shows arable described as poor, arable, good, fine (or prime) - giving four grades.  The bog was probably used for grazing or hay in the summer but unusable in the winter.  There is only one parcel of pasture on the page.