Emily DOWNES - Birmingham

[Thunder Monkey]

Hi, hoping someone can help me find the mother of my 2nd Gt Grandmother - Emily DOWNES.
As well as any further details about her father.

She was born 22 Feb 1874 in Birmingham.
Her father was James DOWNES, as per Emily's marriage certificate.  But he passed before 1893 as he was deceased on same certificate.  NFDK about him.
She married George JACKSON on 16 Jul 1893 in Saltley, Birmingham.
They had 10 children.

I can only find her on 1901 census and onwards.

Thank you in advance for your help.

Cheers, Lee.

[Milliepede]

Is there no birth registration for her in 1874? 

Where has her exact date of birth come from please?

[Mabel Bagshawe]

Where has her exact date of birth come from please?

1939 register, probably

[Milliepede]

Yes probably.

Do all the children have mothers name as Downes?

Failing to find a likely James Downes  .

[Mabel Bagshawe]

They appear to have mmn Downes

The total lack of a trail pre marriage suggests a combination of

a) James being fictitious
b) her age not being correct
c) her mother being with another man and she and Emily using that surname on censuses
d) Emily's real name being different - have come across a few Emmas who turn into Emily

Have checked out the witnesses to the marriage. At first glance there's no obvious connection

[Mabel Bagshawe]

Have found some potential siblings - both have father James Downes, carter, same as Emily

Elizabeth Downes b c1860 - marries Edward Holmes in 1880
Sarah Downes b c1861 - marries Matthew Edgar Edger in 1881

1891  - Aston
Edward Holmes    30    Head
Elizabeth Holmes   29    Wife
Amy T Holmes   8    Daughter
Kate L Holmes   3    Daughter
John R Downes   54    Father-in-law
Emma Downes   17    Sister-in-law

[Mabel Bagshawe]

here's the family in 1881

John Downs  47  Head
Sarah Downs 45
Sarah H. Downs  21
John Downs  14
Robert P. Downs    9    Son
Emma Downs    6
Leah L. Downs    1  (actually granddaughter, as she's with Sarah and Matthew Edge in later years)
William A. Downs   17

Robert marries in 1894 - father James Downes, carter, deceased

No idea why his name is changed

John Ramsden Downes
Age    60
Q3 1892
Aston Vol 6d p210

[Neale1961]

Birth for Emilly
DOWNES, EMMA              Mother - ATKINS 
GRO Reference: 1874  M Quarter in ASTON  Volume 06D  Page 432


Other children registered with mother as Adkin(s) or Atkin(s)

Other children seem to name father as James Downes on their marriage, but he is always John on the census.


MARRIAGE 23 May 1858 Fazeley, St Paul
Bride - Sarah Atkins, age 21.  Her father – Robert ATKINS
Groom - John Downs Ramsdale, age 24. His father – Abraham RAMSDALE


Birth of first son, John was in 1858, with the surname RAMSDALE

[Neale1961]

Sarah ADKIN
Baptised 4 Dec 1834 Drayton Bassett, Stafford
Daughter of Robert and Sarah