Charles Frederick Kimberley

[Helina]

Need help with Charles's wife please.
Charles Frederick Kimberley born 1899 Southwark, In 1923 he married Mary A A Walsh.   Mary was born about 1895 but her surname seems to alter. On the 1939 census she is born on the 1st Sept 1895 married to Charles with a daughter called Elizabeth. Both ancestry and FindMyPast have Mary's baptism on the 22nd Sept 1895 birth again 1 Sept 1895, she was baptised at St. John, Walworth. Now the problem, her name is Mary Ann Alice Carpenter, parents Alfred and Elizabeth Carpenter. Looked for a marriage before 1923 with no luck, maybe she was adopted? Can find no birth reg on the GRO site or FreeBMD with the surname Walsh or Carpenter only one I could find was on ancestry.
"Mary Ann A Carpenter, R date 1895, Oct-Dec, St Saviour Southwark, V1d, P30.
Have I the right Mary who married Charles if so how did her surname get changed.
Any help would be appreciated
helina

[Milliepede]

The marriage certificate from 1923 would be a good starting point to confirm her fathers name.

Can you find her on earlier census as a child under either surname?

[AlanBoyd]

ADDED Probably best to ignore this, but I’ll leave it here just in case.

I found a tree which may or may not be useful – looks very confusing!

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/101139016/person/422552583762/facts?_phsrc=BiS1&_phstart=successSource

Added: Having dug around in the tree, I think it may be a load of rubbish! It has her father dying in 1895 and marrying her mother in 1897, for example.

[Milliepede]

GRO birth registration has mothers name Medrick.  Carpenter surname but the tree has parents marriage 1897 after her birth?

[Milliepede]

Where is the Carpenter family in 1901? 

[softly softly]

Be wary of that tree on Anc*

Marriages Mar 1895   

Carpenter    William Alfred E        Pewsey    5a   209    
Mould    Lucy Knight        Pewsey    5a   209

Births Jun 1896   
Carpenter    Mary Stanley        Pewsey    5a   159

----------

Lucy Knight Carpenter was a witness to Mary Stanleys marriage.

SS

[Milliepede]

You say in 1939 there is a daughter Elizabeth - what maiden name is on her birth registration?

If born 1932 it was Welsh

I think the 1923 marriage is a must to get more clarity on who she names as her father etc

[softly softly]

Where is the Carpenter family in 1901? 

1891 census

Alfred***   Carpenter   Head   Married   Male   35   1856   Tinman   Southwark, Surrey, England
Elizabeth   Carpenter   Wife   Married   Female   34   1857   -   London, Middlesex, England
Alfred*   Carpenter   Son   -   Male   11   1880   Scholar   Southwark, Surrey, England
Samuel   Carpenter   Son   -   Male   0   1891   -   London, Middlesex, England
Henry*   Medrick   Brother in law   Single   Male   34   1857   Dock labourer   London,

* all have mmn Medrick

*** Alfred dies

CARPENTER, ALFRED       39 
GRO Reference: 1895  J Quarter in ST OLAVE  Volume 01D  Page 93

----------------

1901

Elizabeth   Carpenter   Wife   Widow   Female   41   1860   Brush drawer   Southwark, Surrey, England
Alfred   Carpenter   Son   Single   Male   21   1880   Assistant publisher's   Southwark, Surrey, England
Samuel   Carpenter   Son   -   Male   10   1891   -   Southwark, Surrey, England
Alice   Carpenter   Daughter   -   Female   6   1895   -   Southwark, Surrey, England

CARPENTER, MARY  ANN ALICE    MEDRICK 
GRO Reference: 1895  D Quarter in ST SAVIOUR SOUTHWARK LONDON  Volume 01D  Page 30

Wondering if between 1901-11 mother has set up home/remarried?

SS

[Helina]

Thank you for your advice, I have come across a Mary Stanley but ruled her out.
Yes I agree a marriage certificate  is the answer.
I will have a look to see any marriages for the mother Elizabeth, also Charles and Mary's daughter Elizabeth born 1932 gives the mother's surname as Walsh. She also has a sister 1923 but as her name is not on the 1939 reg she could still be alive
helina