Horace (Lawrence?) Gordon KILMISTER

[PatLac]

Hi,

I'm trying to establish if Horace Gordon KILMISTER was known as Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER when he was young.

Horace was born in 1912, father Leonard Henry "Ernest" KILMISTER and mother May Georgina Florence Stilling STRATFORD.

I can see (only the entry, not the record, as I don't have an Ancestry subscription) electoral rolls for Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER (1936, 1946, 1949) and that he is listed in the New Zealand World War 2 ballot lists.

Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER married Martha Le(i)la KILMISTER in 1936.

According to a divorce notice in the newspapers, Martha Lela Kilmister (nee WATENE or WATENEY) was married to Albert Edward Ernest KILMISTER (NZ BDM 1924/6924) and he asked for divorce on the grounds of adultery with his half-brother Gordon KILMISTER. (New Zealand Herald, 2 Mar 1935, page 16)

Albert Edward Ernest KILMISTER was the son of Leonard Henry "Ernest" KILMISTER with his first wife Alice Maud SANDERS, and therefore he was the half-brother of Horace Gordon KILMISTER.

Martha Lela Kilmister died in 1965.

Horace Gordon KILMISTER is listed on the Electoral rolls of 1957, 1969, 1972, 1975, 1978, 1981, 1987. He died in 1988, and his will mentions his wife Audrey Fay KILMISTER.

Raewyn Elsie BRUTON, father Gordon KILMISTER, mother Audrey KILMISTER, died in Queensland in 1992, aged 52, b. 1952.

Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER and Ernest Henry KILMISTER are mentioned in the newspapers regarding a motor cycle smash (Pahiatua Herald, 11 Sep 1931, page 5).

And he's also mentioned as "KILMINSTER"

"FARM WORKER INJURED.
Auckland Star, Volume LXIV, Issue 308, 30 December 1933, Page 14
(By Telegraph.-Own Correspondent.)
HAMILTON, this day.
In attempting to stop a bolting horse,
Mr. Lawrence Gordon Kilminster (21), a farm hand employed by Mr. H. Mann, of Puketaha, tripped over a hayrake and broke his left leg. He was taken to the Waikato Hospital."

So... are Horace Gordon and Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER one and the same person?

Thanks!

P.S. and one more name!


Lawrence David Kilmister and Martha Leila Kilmister to Alexander Price McCardle, William Reginald Russell and George Ernest Stephenson
Entity type:
Item
Code:
R25549336
Years:
1945 - 1945
Box number:
104
Record number:
1945/5048
Location:
Auckland repository
Format:
Text
Item type:
Physical
Access status:
Open
Access statement:
Open access

https://collections.archives.govt.nz/web/arena/search#/entity/aims-archive/R25549336/lawrence-david-kilmister-and-martha-leila-kilmister-to-alexander-price-mccardle%2C-william-reginald-russell-and-george-ernest-stephenson?q=ernest+kilmister&source=aims-archive

And there is a restricted document about Martha Leila KILMISTER'S death.

Coroners Inquests - Case Files - Pukekohe - Kilmister, Martha Leila - Microfilm only [Use copy of MICRO R 4925]

https://collections.archives.govt.nz/web/arena/search#/entity/aims-archive/R24244185/coroners-inquests---case-files---pukekohe---kilmister%2C-martha-leila---microfilm-only-%5Buse-copy-of-micro-r-4925%5D?q=martha+leila&source=aims-archive

[Lucy2]

Raewyn Elsie BRUTON, father Gordon KILMISTER, mother Audrey KILMISTER, died in Queensland in 1992, aged 52.

This daughter according to age at death, was born in c. 1940.   
Her mother is given as Audrey who was a "wife" (and the widow) of Horace Gordon KILMISTER (haven't found a marriage for her yet).   
I suppose you have to check whether this daughter Raewyn
 - was in fact born in 1940 ?? 
 - where born ?
 - where parents married ?

Because back in New Zealand in 1941/1942, Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER was having a child with Martha (married 1936.)

NZ Birth Index

1941 / 81351
KILMISTER - Lawrence Kelvin
Parents :  Martha Teila [sic]    and    Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER
(date of birth, as deduced from NZ birth index is 19 May 1941 )

NZ Deaths

1942 / 17341
KILMISTER - Lawrence Kelvin - aged 9 months   
(date of death is 3 March 1942 - Reg. at Whakatane)

   ~  Lu

[gc1]

Just as information

There is a tree on Family search that has a lot of Kilmister's family on it.

https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/pedigree/landscape/9VS9-2YF

Facts
Alternate Name(s) • 0 Sources
Birth Name
Horace Gordon Kilmister
Also Known As
Gordon Kilmister
Also Known As
Lawrence Kilmister

[PatLac]

Just as information

There is a tree on Family search that has a lot of Kilmister's family on it.

https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/pedigree/landscape/9VS9-2YF

Facts
Alternate Name(s) • 0 Sources
Birth Name
Horace Gordon Kilmister
Also Known As
Gordon Kilmister
Also Known As
Lawrence Kilmister

This is me, haha, along with a family member, pruning that tree. I have added the alternative name because I think I already have some good evidence but the family member hasn't replied to me yet about this particular issue.

[PatLac]

Raewyn Elsie BRUTON, father Gordon KILMISTER, mother Audrey KILMISTER, died in Queensland in 1992, aged 52.

This daughter according to age at death, was born in c. 1940.   
Her mother is given as Audrey who was a "wife" (and the widow) of Horace Gordon KILMISTER (haven't found a marriage for her yet).   
I suppose you have to check whether this daughter Raewyn
 - was in fact born in 1940 ?? 
 - where born ?
 - where parents married ?

Because back in New Zealand in 1941/1942, Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER was having a child with Martha (married 1936.)

NZ Birth Index

1941 / 81351
KILMISTER - Lawrence Kelvin
Parents :  Martha Teila [sic]    and    Lawrence Gordon KILMISTER
(date of birth, as deduced from NZ birth index is 19 May 1941 )

NZ Deaths

1942 / 17341
KILMISTER - Lawrence Kelvin - aged 9 months   
(date of death is 3 March 1942 - Reg. at Whakatane)

   ~  Lu

Thanks Lu! Where have you found this info? According to Queensland BDM she was born in 1952, not 1942? And that's the same (sort of) info on her memorial on Find a Grave (1951)?

The other children of Lawrence (Horace) Gordon and Martha Leila all died in infancy and there's a stillborn as well, as far as I can check on NZ BDM.

I haven't found any marriage yet for Gordon and Audrey Fay but I suspect they have married after 1950 so it's not available on NZ BDM. There's no divorce records for Gordon and Martha Leila and she died in 1965, so maybe they have married after that but could have been living together since 1950-52?

[PatLac]

Another hint that Gordon and Martha Leila could have been separated is that she may have died in Kingseat which was a rural area known for its psychiatric hospital since around 1931.

(and according to Wikipedia "one of New Zealand's notorious haunted locations", spooky).

This info is on her profile on FS and MyHeritage (I can't see the whole familiy tree), under her Maori name, Rangipaura Watene.

The coroner's inquest was held in Pukehohe which corroborates this place of death.


I guess Raewyn is a Maori name? Could she have been the daughter of Martha Leila and adopted by Audrey Fay?

[Lucy2]

Raewyn Elsie BRUTON, father Gordon KILMISTER, mother Audrey KILMISTER, died in Queensland in 1992, aged 52.

Thanks Lu! Where have you found this info? According to Queensland BDM she was born in 1952 not 1942? And that's the same (sort of) info on her memorial on Find a Grave (1951)?

[/quote]

   Only by using the information you provided earlier ....  "died  in Queensland in 1992, aged 52"  ...  which equals a birth year circa 1940. 

     ~  Lu

[PatLac]

Raewyn Elsie BRUTON, father Gordon KILMISTER, mother Audrey KILMISTER, died in Queensland in 1992, aged 52.

Thanks Lu! Where have you found this info? According to Queensland BDM she was born in 1952 not 1942? And that's the same (sort of) info on her memorial on Find a Grave (1951)?

   Only by using the information you provided earlier ....  "died  in Queensland in 1992, aged 52"  ...  which equals a birth year circa 1940. 

     ~  Lu
[/quote]

Haha, sorry, it's her date of birth, not age.

[Lucy2]

The Will of Ernest Henry KILMISTER - was dated 20 June 1951.

https://ndhadeliver.natlib.govt.nz/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE63843077

In referring to his five children, four are mentioned with having second christian names ...
the other is simply named as "Gordon".   

   ~  Lu