Hesse family

[Wexflyer]

Since Monday I have come across the following information from Anc... and Family Search It would appear that John Hess and Judith Cullen had 6 children?? might be more.

I posted earlier in reply No. 8 that I believe I counted at least 7 children. But I have not rechecked.
Edit: Actually it is John Junior and Mary Quinn who may have had 7 children.

[Wexflyer]

A john Hess died age 76 in 1870 birth c 1794 is this the :

Joannem Hess Father Joannis Hess who married Brigida Bagley July 1813 Cahir County Tipperary which would tie in nicely with John Hess above born c 1815 what does everyone think //
thanks Margie

While the John Hess who died in Wexford aged 76 is pretty certain to be your man, I am also pretty certain that he is not the John Hess who married in Cahir in 1813.
- Wrong place, and
- Wrong wife. He was married to Judith Cullen.

[Wexflyer]

Joannem Hess Father Joannis Hess who married Brigida Bagley July 1813 Cahir County Tipperary which would tie in nicely with John Hess above born c 1815 what does everyone think //
thanks Margie

You don't specify which denomination, but there is no such marriage in the Catholic registers for Cahir in July 1813. Note that the use of Latin for the Christian names strongly suggests that it is a Catholic record - if it exists
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632132?locale=en#page/95/mode/1up

It occurs to me that the mention of a father suggests that this might be a baptism record, instead of a marriage. But there is no such baptism either in July 1813, as far as I can see.
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632133?locale=en#page/40/mode/1up

[Wexflyer]

Joannem Hess Father Joannis Hess who married Brigida Bagley July 1813 Cahir County Tipperary which would tie in nicely with John Hess above born c 1815 what does everyone think //
thanks Margie

OK, I see what has happened. Usual junk Ancestry transcription?
John Ahearn was baptized in Cahir on 2 August 1813, son of John Ahearn and Bridget Begley.
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632133?locale=en#page/41/mode/1up

[Wexflyer]

A john Hess died age 76 in 1870 birth c 1794 is this the :

Joannem Hess Father Joannis Hess who married Brigida Bagley July 1813 Cahir County Tipperary which would tie in nicely with John Hess above born c 1815

Apart from the fact that there was no such marriage, I am perplexed as to who is the  "John Hess above born c 1815"??

[marrle]

Ok I am perplexed also I am in my late 70,s sometimes find it difficult to grasp the information you all have found for me but will try and explain where I am coming from :

Going back to my original post we know John Hess married Mary Quinn 1867 it says full age usually reckoning on John being 20 when he married, so is this the John who died in Wexford in 1899 age 48 birth c 1851??
Back a generation to the John Hess & Judy Cullen the first birth Ive found is Edward 1835 others followed and a John born 1841 ?? but who was he ??

So the John Hess who married Judy if Edward was the first child and they married c 1835 I would presume he was born c 1815

However it still does not explain who John Hess died 1870 age 76 birth c1794 was unless i am missing something  hope all this make sense,

Thanks Margie

[shanreagh]

Going back to my original post we know John Hess married Mary Quinn 1867 it says full age usually reckoning on John being 20 when he married, so is this the John who died in Wexford in 1899 age 48 birth c 1851??
......

Full age in Ireland was until relatively recently considered to be 21 years.  So to claim full age you had to be at least 21 years. 

So looking at a marriage in 1867 full age would mean a person being born at least 21 years before.  So in this case 1846.  So the John who died in Wexford with a possible birthdate of 1851 can really only be considered a might be/possibly be at this stage.

You can do more checking by looking at birth certificates of children, marriage certificates possibly, death certificates of children, wife or close relaaltives so you can work out when he was last carrying out these civil duties. You can look at the death certificates to see what he and relatives died from.  Pthsisis Phthisis or TB can kill regardless of age, also influenza/bronchitis.  If he died from TB and children or close relatives also died around then then this may be a good find.  Also check to see who reported the death. 

On the other side of this we know that back in those days with low literacy levels etc that birthdays etc were not considered as important to celebrate as nowadays.  This all changed when the Old Age Pensions came in and there was a scramble to establish births by searches of baptisms and by looking at what are now census fragments. 

[shanreagh]

As to what to do now.

I think you could go back to doing a staged, step by step process backwards from you or you nearest ancestor that you have fully established the birth, marriage and death dates for.  Say your grandparents

From records try to find the BDM dates for the parents, also BDM dates for siblings.  Doing it this way means you don't miss out on clues such as naming patterns, occupation changes or townland or country changes.

Working from a distant ancestor down to you of course can be done but in my experience takes a bit more work and nous to do. 

So I would put aside for now trying to work out if this or that far distant person might be an ancestor until you have done the ground work to establish a stepping back point and then work carefully back. You may meet these people on the way back or you may not...or you might find, like I have for one ancestor a gap of a generation.....

[Wexflyer]

Marriage of Elizabeth Hess and James Booth in 1892
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1892/10628/5872257.pdf

I have posted this as she was:
- A daughter of John Hess Junior, and was the informant when he died in 1899, and
- John Hess was reported to be a docker. When he married in 1867 he was a carman.