John Hill Coffee House Keeper Shoreditch 1832 East End History

[Dave Francis]

Coffee House Keeper and Coffee Roaster seem to be unusual-ish jobs at the time, in a small area, with the same (albeit) highly common surname. Just wondered if anyone had any knowledge/opinions on the above? Grateful, as always.

From my copy of "Consuming Passion" by Judith Flanders...

"They were on to a winning thing, for over the next five years [following 1657] another 83 coffee houses appeared; by 1801 there were over 500 in London alone, and they had developed as places to drink coffee and meet friends, and, equally importantly, as places to conduct business.
     "Outside London, much social life was maintained in these coffee rooms; they were centres of information and news, and they served a wide range of readers, from the whitesmith to the idle dandy. By 1833 the Manchester Coffee and Newsroom took 96 papers a week, plus several periodicals and reviews; it cost 1d. to sit and read, 2d. with coffee thrown in. The Exchange Coffee House, also in Manchester, riposted with 130 papers a week, 186 on Saturdays, as well as a range of foreign papers. The upper classes had their own coffee houses, particularly in the spa and resort towns. In 1739 Tunbridge Wells had three coffee houses that we know of, perhaps more, where for 5s. visitors could have 'the use of pens, ink, paper &c.' "

[Littlebn20]

Oh, to be a fly on the wall! I had no idea that coffee was such a big commodity back then. Learning new things on this journey all the time!

[J.J.]

Wow, I couldn't get on with only a few posts earlier...now 3 pages of replies!!!
***adding: yes, Dave, I was taken back by the amount of coffee houses as well, but also saw that taverns & brandy-houses and coffee-houses could all be in one place.
Noting that Pepys met with many people at his coffee houses...

Publications:
The Lay-man's sermon upon the late storm; held forth at an honest Coffee-House-Conventicle
The Character of a coffee-house with the symptomes of a town-wit: April 11th, 1673
By the King. A proclamation for the suppression of coffee-houses published 1675
  (probably to stop the gabbers from putting down leaders...as in this one:)
The Usurpers: or The coffee-house politicians. A farce [electronic resource] 1749

   This one may just be coincidence but you never know...
Letter to Captain Edwards from the Chief and factors at Mocha requesting that nothing be carried on board ship which might adversely affect the coffee through its smell. The letter is dated 15 July 1719 from John Hill and Edward Say, on behalf of Court of Directors of the East India Company.   Date: 13 Jun 1720     It was received via the ship Susannah, on 17 June 1720.   

 All, or only the one? Maybe the will below will help solve? Records: Sun Fire Insurance, London:
 John Hill, 189 Church Street, Shoreditch, coffee house keeper -24 May 1832
 John Hill 3 Albemarle Street Clerkenwell coffee house keeper -18 March 1829
 John Hill 4 Commercial Place City Road coffee house keeper -25 February 1830
      Other property or occupiers: Wadding manufacturer 
 John Hill, 12 Vittoria Street White Conduit Fields, gent  -15 Dec 1830
      Other property/occupiers: 3 Albermarle Street Clerkenwell (coffee house keeper)
 * John Hill, "189 Church Street" , Shoreditch, coffee house keeper
        Other property or occupiers: Garden Terrace, City Road 24 May 1832
 * by 1834 a Francis Gostelow is paying insurance at 189 Church Street
    p.s. The same address was insured by a butcher at turn of the century!!!

also:
Will of John Hill, Coffee House Keeper of Saint Mary Lambeth , Surrey Date: 24 May 1852

Old Bailey Proceedings 1795- a Thomas Hill was keep of the Fountain Coffee house,
Addle-street near Aldermanbury (which, according to the hearing also served beer)

[Littlebn20]

Thanks, this is a lot of really interesting information. I need to see if I can establish a family link, or disprove it now. You have all been really helpful, thank you. @J.J Do you happen to have access to the particulars of the 1852 will. I am pretty sure that my Eliphalet died in 1848, but I would be interested to learn if there were any references to a wife Susannah, or any other potential children.

[J.J.]

  Might be the only one on the post who doesn't!    I see that poor Susanah appears to have given birth to a baker's dozen! What was the father's occupation on all these births?

Also, since you have posted John Hill Coffee House & named it as such, you'll be getting posts about both. The proximity of these John Hills still could mean relatives were employing them... The fact that they were in my ancestors old stomping grounds has peaked my interest. They'd have likely visited several!

Further to Bbart's find, this fellow was born out of London, and we don't know if your John was born in London, either, or do we? Some of mine went a long way to marry & also sometimes to bear children.
  Owners of the The Magpie,  John Hill  1828-1886
  Age 65  Birth 1772-1776  "Bedford Street" (will 1853)
 1841 census Woburn, Bedfordshire, Eng
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQRS-H8V
  John Hill 76 years Birth 1775  Newport, Buckinghamshire
 -wife Sarah   in 1851 census Woburn, Bedfordshire, Eng
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGCH-48D
 still owned by a John B. hill in 1881 at sale of the Inn
 If this one,  born 1847 Clapton, Middlesex, England
https://bedsarchives.bedford.gov.uk/CommunityHistories/Woburn/LongsHotelWoburn.aspx
Place still looked the same in the listing photo
https://historicengland.org.uk/listing/the-list/list-entry/1146456
 Also found a John Hill of Wooburn, Bedford Widowed - Banns & marriages 5 Sept 1794
married Jane Hull, also widowed, of Wavendon at Wavendon, Buckinghamshire
 and a John Hill Birth 1815 Birthplace Potsgrove, Bedfordshire
"Bedford Street"  1861 Woburn, Bedfordshire, England, United Kingdom

[Littlebn20]

Still all very speculative as to whether or not he is actually my John Hill or not and the more I hear about him, the less likely I think it is as my Hill's don't appear to have come from money at all. What I know for certain is that Eliphalet Hill was born in 1805 to John Hill and Susannah, address on baptism given as New Castle Street in Shoreditch. It is not clear from my research if John and Susannah had any other children. The Witnesses on Eliphalet's marriage record to Mary Wright are William and Sarah Sadler. There was a Susannah Sadler born to William & Sarah Sadler in 1773 in Shoreditch, so have established that this likely the Susannah that was Eliphalet's mother. That's basically all I have got. Eliphalet Hill is seemingly the only Eliphalet in London in that period. I have been pondering on the unusual name for years. I have no Jewish ancestry, but it is very much a Hebrew name, pronounced Ihl-ah-falet.

UPDATE: Sophia Hill - Born to John & Susannah, Whitechapel 1798
              Sarah Hill - Born to John & Susannah, Whitechapel 1802
              John Hill - Born to John & Susannah, Whitechapel 1803

Does anyone have access to birth records to check these records for address/father occupation?

[J.J.]

   Perhaps someone might be kind enough to look into these for you, to see if they have an occupation for John ...not sure if all yours, but consecutive, so, perhaps.
 
Parents John Hill, Susanna (or Susan)
-George Hill Birth  2 Jan 1794  Bapt 26 Jan 1794 St Leonard's, Shoreditch, M
-Sarah Hill Chr  13 September 1795 Saint Mary Matfelon, Stepney, Middlesex, Eng
-Sophia Hill Bapt  15 April 1798 Whitechapel, Middlesex, Eng
-William Hill  Birth  17 Jan 1800  Bapt 11 January 1801 Saint Mary Matfelon...
-John Hill  Chris 2 October 1803 Saint Mary Matfelon...
-Sarah Hill Birth  29 March 1802   Christ 6 Jan 1803 Saint Mary Matfelon...
-Eliphalet Hill  Baptism  15 Dec 805 Whitechapel, Middlesex, Eng
-William Hill Birth  22 August 1809    Bapt 10 Sept 1809 Shoreditch, Middlesex,Eng
-Mary Ann Hill   Birth Feb 23    Bapt 29 March 1812  Shoreditch...
-William Hill Birth  18 March 1814  Bapti  17 April 1814 Shoreditch....
-John Marcus Hill  Birth  21 Feb 1815   Bapt 12 March 1815 Shoreditch...
-Hannah Hill  Birth  3 Nov 1816  Bapt   25 Nov 1816 Shoreditch...
-Alfred Irvine Hill  Birth  21 Dec  1817  Bapt  8 Feb 1818 Shoreditch...

[bbart]

Parents John Hill, Susanna (or Susan) (written as recorded)
-George Hill Birth  2 Jan 1794  Bapt 26 Jan 1794 St Leonard's, Shoreditch, M
John and Susanna of Smith Buildings, no occupation

-Sarah Hill Chr  13 September 1795 Saint Mary Matfelon, Stepney, Middlesex, Eng
John and Susannah, Castle Alley, no occupations

-Sophia Hill Bapt  15 April 1798 Whitechapel, Middlesex, Eng
John and Susan, Castle Street, no occupations given

-William Hill  Birth  17 Jan 1800  Bapt 11 January 1801 Saint Mary Matfelon...
John and Susan, Castle Street, no occupations given

-John Hill  Chris 2 October 1803 Saint Mary Matfelon...
John and Susanna, Castle Street, no occupations listed (St Mary, Whitechapel)

-Sarah Hill Birth  29 March 1802   Christ 6 Jan 1803 Saint Mary Matfelon...
John and Susannah, New Castle Street, no occupations given

-Eliphalet Hill  Baptism  15 Dec 805 Whitechapel, Middlesex, Eng
John and Susanna, New Castle Street, no occupations given

-William Hill Birth  22 August 1809    Bapt 10 Sept 1809 Shoreditch, Middlesex,Eng
John and Susanna, Union Walk, no occupations given

-Mary Ann Hill   Birth Feb 23    Bapt 29 March 1812  Shoreditch...
John and Susanna, Swan Yard, no occupations listed

-William Hill Birth  18 March 1814  Bapti  17 April 1814 Shoreditch....
John and Susannah, New Inn Yard, twine spinner

-John Marcus Hill  Birth  21 Feb 1815   Bapt 12 March 1815 Shoreditch...
father John, a carpenter, and mother Susannah, Hoxton Town

-Hannah Hill  Birth  3 Nov 1816  Bapt   25 Nov 1816 Shoreditch...
John and Susanna, New Inn yard, ropemaker

-Alfred Irvine Hill  Birth  21 Dec  1817  Bapt  8 Feb 1818 Shoreditch...
Father John is a silversmith, mother Susan, abode New Inn Yard

[bbart]

Immediately under the marriage of Eliphalet , is a marriage, on the same day, for a William Hill marrying Charlotte Turner, in which Sophia Hill was a witness; matching the Castle Street Hill baptisms.