Author Topic: The National Archives  (Read 1788 times)

Offline lisa23

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The National Archives
« on: Friday 27 September 24 09:38 BST (UK) »
Hi
I found a record (ADM 73/187/41) that I am interested in, that was on TNA but it has not yet been digitised. As I am in Australia, I cannot go in to view. I see you can request from them but I don't understand their terms. It cost £8.40 non-refundable for a page check (does that mean all 5 documents attached to this record) to see if they can send me a copy. Does this mean if I can get a copy, they are going to charge me more.
Hodgson, Sorlie, Millett, Knight, Brown, Smith, Callagan, Rudd, Severn, Braxton, O’Dell, Purcell, Gorman, Finn, Larkings, Larkins, Coleman, Bernhard

Offline mckha489

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #1 on: Friday 27 September 24 11:18 BST (UK) »
Hi
I found a record (ADM 73/187/41) that I am interested in, that was on TNA but it has not yet been digitised. As I am in Australia, I cannot go in to view. I see you can request from them but I don't understand their terms. It cost £8.40 non-refundable for a page check (does that mean all 5 documents attached to this record) to see if they can send me a copy. Does this mean if I can get a copy, they are going to charge me more.

Yes. They give you a quote for a digital copy of all the pages once they have looked.

You just have to tell yourself it’s cheaper than a plane ticket!

Offline Watson

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #2 on: Friday 27 September 24 14:36 BST (UK) »
This may sound insensitive, but I think the charge for the quote is justified, since without it the cost would need to be absorbed by TNA., and it is fairer that the user should pay for it.

Depending on the nature of your search, an alternative plan could be to hire a record searcher to search the document for you.  The charge might be, roughly, in the region of £25 per hour, plus travelling expenses, though the latter should be mitigated if the agent is doing work for other clients at the same location.

Offline theirchild

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 28 September 24 07:47 BST (UK) »
Hi Lisa23,

TNA has a page explaining what they charge beyond the £8.40 "Page Check" fee. Scroll down to the section subtitled "Copies of Records – less than 100 different pages of records". Here's the link:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/record-copying/fees/

If I've read it correctly, their copying service is less expensive than I imagined...certainly, as Mckha489 says, cheaper than a plane ticket. But there are a few things it might be advisable to keep in mind:

Firstly, the page check includes them "reviewing the document to assess if the information can be located" and "checking its suitability for copying". See:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/record-copying/
     
So if they were unable to find the information you're seeking, or it's unsuitable for copying (which I guess means too fragile or possibly something else), it appears that you would receive absolutely nothing - apart from a "we're unable to..." message - in exchange for the non-refundable fee.

Also, as you mentioned, the record you're seeking consists of five documents and (if I've not misunderstood) you're unsure if the £8.40 fee would cover all five. Whether it would, or whether you'd need to pay £8.40 for each of them (i.e. a total of £42) is not very clear, in my opinion; but it does say "reviewing the document" rather than "reviewing the record" which could mean £8.40 each. The only way to be sure is to contact TNA directly and ask for clarification. They offer a live chat service but if the time difference between Australia and the UK presents a barrier to using that, they also have an enquiry form. Both can be found here:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/contact-us/make-a-records-and-research-enquiry/

NB: Although the page is headed "Make a records and research enquiry", the form and live chat are also for enquiries about record copying, as stated on these pages:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/information-management/keeping-touch/contacts/

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/contact-us/

Secondly, if you decide to place an order, it may be best to order a digital copy because the cost of postage and packing for a paper copy would be in addition to the copying charge (and probably not cheap). See here:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/record-copying/

Thirdly, on top of the TNA fee, your bank might charge you for a purchase made in a foreign currency (£sterling), rather than in A$.

Fourthly, the record you're hoping to get copied seems to be among Greenwich Hospital School Admission papers. I've never looked at those but other school admission papers I've seen provide only a few details for each child - no more, or hardly anything more, than is contained in the record description on the TNA website. So the five documents in the record (which I guess relate to the five named siblings) could each be no more than one sheet in length; and, apart from details of the relevant child, be filled either with lots of white space or with details of other, possibly unrelated, children who appear on the same page. 

To sum up, despite TNA's copying charges apparently being less prohibitive than I anticipated, you might wish to consider whether you're comfortable with the total cost for potentially, at best, a very small amount of data.

If you do decide to place an order, TNA advises that page checks normally take up to ten working days to complete and copying normally takes up to 14 days (but may take longer) - see here again:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/record-copying/

Good luck with your research,

theirchild
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--------------------------
NAME INTERESTS

ANDERSON: Shoreditch, Bethnal Grn & Glasgow
AVIS: Mayfield & Rotherfield
BASSETT: Mayfield, Rotherfield, Wadhurst, Ticehurst, Tunbridge Wells & nearby
MANN: Stepney & Shoreditch
MILLS: Shoreditch
RUSSELL: Mayfield & Burwash
SCHOLTZ: Islington & Kentish Town
WITT: Christchurch & nearby (Hants)


Offline Bookbox

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 28 September 24 09:02 BST (UK) »
It cost £8.40 non-refundable for a page check (does that mean all 5 documents attached to this record) to see if they can send me a copy

Yes, all 5 documents.

The result of the page check includes a quote for copying, which you can accept or decline. It's not likely to be very much more, as these particular files are not large.

Please see my earlier post for details of what you are likely to find in this file ...
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=861817.msg7311136#msg7311136

Offline theirchild

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 28 September 24 09:38 BST (UK) »
Hi there Bookbox,

I'm very pleased that a Rootschatter with more specific knowledge arrived to assist Lisa23.

Your post also helps me by correcting and/or superseding parts of my post above - so provides valuable learning.

Thanks very much!

theirchild

Rootschat is free. Saying "thanks" also costs nothing.

"Gratitude is the sign of a noble soul."
- Aesop

"Gratitude is the fairest blossom."
- Henry Ward Beecher
--------------------------
NAME INTERESTS

ANDERSON: Shoreditch, Bethnal Grn & Glasgow
AVIS: Mayfield & Rotherfield
BASSETT: Mayfield, Rotherfield, Wadhurst, Ticehurst, Tunbridge Wells & nearby
MANN: Stepney & Shoreditch
MILLS: Shoreditch
RUSSELL: Mayfield & Burwash
SCHOLTZ: Islington & Kentish Town
WITT: Christchurch & nearby (Hants)

Offline lisa23

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Re: The National Archives
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 28 September 24 13:05 BST (UK) »
Thank you all for your replies. I was just trying to get an idea how much it would cost to get the record. I understand that there are costs to check records etc, but was wondering whether it would charge for each document or the set (£8.40 or £42) plus the additional charges to get copies sent via email. Thank you theirchild for the informative reply to help me decide on whether to get this document. You made it so much clearer for me to understand how TNA works.
Hodgson, Sorlie, Millett, Knight, Brown, Smith, Callagan, Rudd, Severn, Braxton, O’Dell, Purcell, Gorman, Finn, Larkings, Larkins, Coleman, Bernhard