Jessie Maitland Milne

[MrsGnomus]

I am looking for advice about where else I can look to try and find when and where my husband's great grandmother died.

She was born Jessie Birnie Maitland Leith on 20 July 1888 at 20 Park Street Aberdeen. Her mother was Agnes Leith and she married Jessie's reputed father James Maitland in 1890.

Jessie married Charles Milne on 19 January 1907. They had a total of 5 children, 3 daughters and 2 sons. Their first daughter Robina was born in December 1905 and died in May 1906. Their third daughter Rosehannah was born in 1908 and died in 1919. Their other children were:-

Margaret, born 1907, died 1980
Charles, born 1910, died 1973 (my husband's grandfather)
George, born 1914, died 1937

I have found the family in the 1911 Census when they were living at 115 Gallowgate in Aberdeen. Charles (senior) was described as a Dock Labourer - Coal.

By the date of the 1921 Census things seem to have got significantly worse for the family, Jessie, her husband and Margaret were living at 3 Raggs Lane in Aberdeen (Jessie is listed as the tenant in the valuation rolls for 1920) and the two sons were living in the Aberdeen Poorhouse. Jessie was described as a fish worker and seems to have been in regular employment but her husband was described as a casual labourer.

I can't find Jessie listed as a tenant in the 1925 Valuation Rolls at that address. There are 3 other Jessie Milne's listed in 1925 but they all have matching addresses to some of the Jessie Milne's that are in the 1920 records so I am pretty sure that i can exclude them.

Her husband died on 19 January 1930 at Woodend Hospital. His usual address was listed as the home of his oldest brother George and the informant was listed as George's wife Helen. I have no idea when he went to live with his brother or what the circumstances for that move were. The record of his death says that he was married to Jessie Maitland - it doesn't say that he was a widower. I presume that means that she was still alive at that point.

The next pieces of information are the marriage records of the three children who survived into adulthood. Margaret married on 4 December 1931 - both her parents were described as deceased.
George married on 2 November 1935 - both parents were again described as deceased. Charles married on 14 November 1936 and again both parents were described as deceased.

I can't find a record of when Jessie died - even when I search from 1921 onwards (the census record being the last definite evidence that she was still alive) and searching using Milne, Maitland and Leith as possible surnames and not limiting the search to Aberdeenshire. I also can't find any evidence that she remarried after her husband died.

Any suggestions for where to look next would be great.  Am I missing something obvious?

[Archivos]

This is a frustrating one, isn't it! Her children would surely have known that she was indeed deceased by the time they were married, so the window really should only be from 1921 to 1931. It does seem strange that the informant on Charles Milne's death is his sister-in-law, especially as he died in hospital, but might explain why Jessie is given as Jessie Maitland, rather than Leith.*

*Edited to add - Jessie would have been Maitland, as her mother later married her father!

However, if something happened between 1921 and 1931, as Charles and Jessie don't seem to be living together, then it may be that the children lost touch with their mother and assumed that she had died. Widening the date range at at Scotland's People centre might be an idea, as you'll be able to view more certificates that way, including those beyond the cut off dates.

Could she have gone to prison? Newspapers might have something, it'd be worth a look if you've not done so.

What's also frustrating is that the Aberdeen city poor records for that time are very patchy, with no real records surviving. There is a list at the city archives (archives [at] aberdeencity.gov.uk) of people who were in Oldmill and in receipt of poor relief under reference C/16/3/1. They are currently closed as they're moving premises, but it's worth an email to them. There are also Woodend Hospital records held at NHS Grampian Archives (gram.archives [at] nhs.scot) - they might not give you any more information than is on Charles's death cert, but again worth an enquiry.

[Flattybasher9]

Did you look at the 1970 death record for a Jessie Maitland, aged 81 Aberdeen, 168/1/218. May not be her, but perhaps worth a look.

Regards

Malky

[MrsGnomus]

Thanks for the suggestions.

I have already checked the 1970 death record - that Jessie Maitland was the widow of a James Maitland with her maiden surname given as Smith.

I will have a look through the newspapers that are available on line again although I have already trawled through them once. I will also see if I can find out if she was admitted to the poorhouse after 1921. Admission to a psychiatric hospital or a fever hospital would also be a possibility (the daughter who did in 1919 died of TB) but I would still have expected her death to be registered somewhere if she was an inpatient in an institution.

Since my original post I have discovered that her husband was conscripted in WW1 and was an “Engine man” on a “Hired Trawler” (minesweeper). After the end of the war he was demobilised from the Navy in 1919 and almost immediately re-enlisted into the Land Corps (after the death of the daughter who died in 1919) so he didn’t return to Aberdeen permanently until the second half of 1920. The records imply that the re-enlistment was his choice.

His recorded address when he was conscripted was his brother’s address but that’s not where the family were living in 1911 and it’s also not the address where his son George was born in October 1914 (2 months after he was conscripted). It is the address that the family were apparently living in 1919 when their daughter died as that’s what’s on her death record. His address when he was demobilised in 1920 was given as Raggs Lane. I don’t know when their 2 sons were admitted to the Poorhouse - I just know that it was before the 1921 census date (my father in law didn’t know that his father had been there until I told him last year). I guess it’s possible that the sons were placed there during the war so that Jessie could work but that doesn't explain why they were still there in 1921. I think it’s probably more likely that the family were always struggling financially and periodically ended up living at his brothers address. The new information doesn’t really get me any closer to finding out what happened to Jessie after 1921 though.
 

[rosie17]

Have you checked this death
Jessie M Milne
Birth year 1889
Age 45 years
Death 1934
Flyde
Lancashire

Findagrave Fleetwood Cemetery
Jessie Maitland Milne
Death May 1934

Also on deceasedonline it might not be her but worth checking

There doesn't appear to be any deaths for her on Scotlandspeople so maybe she moved To England
There seems to be a death in the paper for this Jessie Maitland Milne 1934
Address 79,Dock Street Fleetwood ( Fleetwood Chronicle ) also a record 1933 of her being Drunk and disorderly .I can see a few records for her before 1920 in Aberdeen being Drunk



Rosie

[MrsGnomus]

Thanks for suggesting that.  I had the death in Fleetwood previously but the search that I was using didn't give the middle name so I hadn't pursued it any further before today.

I think that it's almost certainly the person that I am looking for as the GRO digital record for her death states that she was the widow of a Charles Milne.  The cause of death was given as acute pulmonary tuberculosis. Two of her children also died of tuberculosis.

I also spent sometime trawling through various newspaper articles this afternoon as at least one of the archives that I don't normally have access to unless I go to the library is free this weekend. It seems that in 1915 she was found guilty of child neglect, as a result of her alcohol abuse, and her youngest child who was only 13 months old was very close to dying. The newspaper article mentions that three of the children had been admitted to the City Hospital with "consumption" (TB) and that she had also been admitted with the same condition but had refused to stay in hospital.

As you say there are a number of records of her being drunk and ending up in Court including the record from Fleetwood the year before her death so it looks like she never got in control of her drinking. I have no idea how she will have ended up living in Fleetwood after her husband died though.

I did check the deceased online and discovered that there are two individuals buried in the same plot with a John Binning Douglas who died in 1932 being in the same plot which adds to the mystery as with only 2 burials in the pot it seems unlikely that it was a paupers grave.

[rosie17]

The death for John Binning Douglas 1932 in the Fleetwood Chronicle also gives his address as Dock Street Fleetwood .There is also a record for him also being drunk 1929 so it looks like they could have been living together


Rosie

[rosie17]

There is  possibility this John Binning Douglas was born in Scotland

W

[Millmoor]

Doing a general search for John Binning Douglas suggests he may have been born in Edinburgh in 1878.

There are a number of records for the above in Lincolnshire in the 1920's, including seaman's records. It is also worth searching the newspaper archive while you have access for him in Grimsby ( I searched under John B Douglas). There are a couple of articles referring to him, one involving drink!

Of particular interest is an electoral roll from 1927. Recorded at 197 King Edward Street Grimsby are John Binning Douglas and Jessie Maitland Douglas.

I would suggest that what ties the locations of Aberdeen, Grimsby and Fleetwood together is the fishing industry. John Binning Douglas worked on trawlers .

William