SS Peter & Paul RC Wolverhampton marriage 1855-1862 DONLAND (actually Donlin)

[MegMS]

Hello and thank you for reading this.
I've searched and can find only an index and suspect the parish register pages are held by either the church itself still or Archdiocese of Birmingham Archives, tho their site indicates only indices available.

The index, screenshot attached, says "C. 51. Donland (Kennedy) Thomas -- Margaret Holland Spelman"
So Volume C, p. 51.  Volume C covers marriages from June 5, 1854 to Dec. 31, 1900.  This marriage probably took place before the birth of their first son in Nov., 1860.

This entry does confirm their mothers' maiden names (Kennedy and Holland), which is great!  But her name before and after marriage was WINIFRED!  His mother was Margaret and maybe an error was made there.  I hope to also learn their ages and where they were living and his occupation.

Thank you very much for any assistance or advice!
Meg

OK IDK how to add/upload a screenshot here, but here is the link: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSZL-89V5-4?cat=762330

[heywood]

I am not sure of this at all.
However the civil marriage on Free BMD indexes is:

March quarter 1860 where
Thomas Kennedy and Margaret Holland are on the same page.

[MegMS]

Thank you!  Wow!  That explains why I've struck out at FreeBMD with every variation of Donlin and Spelman I could imagine.  I did try Holland, but of course I'm looking for Winifred, not Margaret.
I will look for that one!  Thanks so much!

But, I wonder why the civil record would have their mothers' maiden names???

[CaroleW]

English Marriage certs do not show either mothers christian name or her maiden name.  That info is only found on birth certs

The document appears to be one specific to the church & may be why that info is recorded

[MegMS]

Thanks, CarolW.  I wondered if the church would turn over records to the government Registry Office.  It was odd that the mothers' maiden names were included in the church parish register, and the transcriber (the PP of 1908) noted that 2 surnames were given for each.  I can see that if the info came to the Registrar from the church, he would have recorded it that way.

I've sent off for a copy of the certificate.  I'll let you all know if it is indeed my Thomas Donlin and Winifred Spelman!

[CaroleW]

Link to tree on Ancestry

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/9213074/person/362133163992/facts

Link to 1851 census for Winifred
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8860/images/STSHO107_2018_2019-0115?pId=8523963

Indexed as Shelman she was working for the Holland family

1861 Winifrid Danlin

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/8767/images/STSRG9_2037_2040-0502?pId=20491794

Findagrave

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/discoveryui-content/view/82122224:60525

[MegMS]

That's my tree, CarolW, lol!  Thanks, tho.  Funny, the UK version has larger print!

[MegMS]

I sent for and finally received the marriage certificate.  It says:
Thomas Kennedy / 24 years / Bachelor /Ironworks Laborer / Canal Street Wolverhampton / Father Thomas Kennedy / Carpenter
Margaret Holland / 21 years / Spinster / ---- / Canal Street Wolverhampton / Father James Holland / Forge Laborer
Married in the Catholic Chapel of St Peter and St Paul North Street Wolverhampton by George Duckett M.R.
8th Jan. 1860
Wit: Patrick Leonard and Catherine Burke

Wouldn't the couple have had to give this info to the registrar themselves?  Or could the registrar have gotten the info from the church?

Is there any way to view the original church entry in Volume C, page 51?  It's not on Family Search; just the index. 

The time and place are correct for my gg-gps.  The names are weirdly off-- Thomas DONLIN was the son of Margaret Kennedy and JAMES Donlin; WINIFRED Spelman was the daughter of Mary MulHOLLAND and James Spelman.  I can't believe it's just coincidence!

Thank you for any thoughts or suggestions!

[heywood]

The registrar would be in attendance at the church.
Church records often showed the mother’s name as well as the father’s name.

You could contact the archives here to see if you could check or have the parish records checked.
http://www.birminghamarchdiocesanarchives.org.uk/
Although searching the collections, it looks as though just indexes are there.

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01tg4/

In some dioceses the churches retain the records - here is the parish
https://www.carloacutis.co.uk/

You might want to contact there too.