Newcastle Emlyn - Thomas Family

[Glynazard]

Hi all!

I've been researching my family tree and my maternal Grandmother, Sarah Iris Thomas, was born in Newcastle Emlyn.

She moved to Cardiff but I'm not exactly sure when. But, all of her siblings, parents and scores of generations before that were born and lived in Newcastle Emlyn.

I've hit a bit of a blocker so I'm wondering if any more research has been done/if mine is even correct. Additionally, I'm also wondering if I have any extended family in the area too!

There are a number of Maiden names too - my Great-Grandmother was a Bateman and we also have Davies, Jones and Williams (bit of a needle in a haystack in Wales).

[QueenoftheWest]

Welcome to RootsChat!

This looks like the birth registration of your grandmother:

THOMAS, SARAH  IRIS        
GRO Reference: 1931  D Quarter in NEWCASTLE IN EMLYN  Volume 11B  Page 23

Mother's maiden name is given as Bateman, as you have stated.

Is there specific information you are seeking? You say you've hit a bit of a blocker, but you have given a variety of surnames in your tree that suggest you have tracked further back than Sarah so is there an ancestor futher back that is your brick wall? Just asking so we know exactly what you want assistance with and don't answer your query with information you already know.

Queenie 

[Glynazard]

Thanks, Queenie!

I thought I'd put some attachments in but alas, I did not!

So I know my Grandmother's parents were William Thomas and Ivy Bateman.

Also know that William's parents were Thomas Thomas and Sarah Davies (Thomas' second wife).

I believe Thomas' Father was a David Thomas.

I can't seem to get any further than Sarah Davies on the other side.

I'm learning that Welsh ancestry in particular can be a little tricky!

[Cas (stallc)]

Looking at the Bateman side, this seems to be the parents of Sarah Iris b 1931.

Marriages Jun Q 1929   
Bateman    Ivy M -    Thomas    Cardiff    11a   612    
Thomas    William    - Bateman    Cardiff    11a   612

Couple can be found in 1939 in Cardiff area with 2 redacted entries (likely children)

1911 -  Ivy can be found with parents William Harry Bateman & wife Martha. Monmouthshire

There is a baptism for Ivy at same address as 1911 with these parents.

There is a possible marriage in 1879
Marriages Dec  Q1879   - same page
BATEMAN    William Harry        Cardigan    11b   15    
Lewis    Martha        Cardigan    11b   15    

The couple seem to have no children with them throughout census, but Ivy is born in their 50s. I am wondering if she is possibly adopted?

Her birth reg has no mother's maiden name, so likely illegitimate. Would possibly obtain cert to see if info matches. Available as a digital download £3.00 from GRO.

BATEMAN, IVY  MARY     - 
GRO Reference: 1910  J Quarter in BEDWELLTY  Volume 11A  Page 137

Welcome to Rootschat

Cas
 

[Glynazard]

Looking at the Bateman side, this seems to be the parents of Sarah Iris b 1931.

Marriages Jun Q 1929   
Bateman    Ivy M -    Thomas    Cardiff    11a   612    
Thomas    William    - Bateman    Cardiff    11a   612

Couple can be found in 1939 in Cardiff area with 2 redacted entries (likely children)

1911 -  Ivy can be found with parents William Harry Bateman & wife Martha. Monmouthshire

There is a baptism for Ivy at same address as 1911 with these parents.

There is a possible marriage in 1879
Marriages Dec  Q1879   - same page
BATEMAN    William Harry        Cardigan    11b   15    
Lewis    Martha        Cardigan    11b   15    

The couple seem to have no children with them throughout census, but Ivy is born in their 50s. I am wondering if she is possibly adopted?

Her birth reg has no mother's maiden name, so likely illegitimate. Would possibly obtain cert to see if info matches. Available as a digital download £3.00 from GRO.

BATEMAN, IVY  MARY     - 
GRO Reference: 1910  J Quarter in BEDWELLTY  Volume 11A  Page 137

Welcome to Rootschat

Cas

Oh, that's interesting and certainly makes sense. I'll see what I can find!

[Glynazard]

Looking at the Bateman side, this seems to be the parents of Sarah Iris b 1931.

Marriages Jun Q 1929   
Bateman    Ivy M -    Thomas    Cardiff    11a   612    
Thomas    William    - Bateman    Cardiff    11a   612

Couple can be found in 1939 in Cardiff area with 2 redacted entries (likely children)

1911 -  Ivy can be found with parents William Harry Bateman & wife Martha. Monmouthshire

There is a baptism for Ivy at same address as 1911 with these parents.

There is a possible marriage in 1879
Marriages Dec  Q1879   - same page
BATEMAN    William Harry        Cardigan    11b   15    
Lewis    Martha        Cardigan    11b   15    

The couple seem to have no children with them throughout census, but Ivy is born in their 50s. I am wondering if she is possibly adopted?

Her birth reg has no mother's maiden name, so likely illegitimate. Would possibly obtain cert to see if info matches. Available as a digital download £3.00 from GRO.

BATEMAN, IVY  MARY     - 
GRO Reference: 1910  J Quarter in BEDWELLTY  Volume 11A  Page 137

Welcome to Rootschat

Cas

Spoke to my Uncle and he believes that Ivy was raised by William and Martha before going back to her birth mother when she was age 10.

William and Martha were her Great Uncle and Aunt.

Her birth mother may have been called Alice Foan/Alice Hollis and she owned a dress shop.

Looking at the dates, it suggests that Alice would have been 18 when she had Ivy.

But none of this is confirmed.

[Cas (stallc)]

Interesting..

Do you know when Thomas first wife died?

Have you looked back on the 1901 for Sarah. She is with the Thomas children. Head is Hannah Davies, which maybe related.

Hannah Davies   84   Head
Sarah Thomas 36 Wife
Elizabeth Thomas 11 Daughter
Thomas Thomas 10 Son
Annie Thomas 7 Daughter
James Thomas 5 Son

Think she married Thomas 1898?

Cas

[Cas (stallc)]

A possible for Sarah & family, but you really need her marriage to confirm. Family can be found in census.

1881 Civil parish   Kilrhedyn,
John Davies 44 Head farmer
Sarah Davies 43 Wife
William Davies 20 Son
Benjamin Davies 18 Son
Sarah Davies   16   Daughter Cilrhedyn,
David Davies 15 Son
Jane Davies 13 Daughter
Thomas Davies 9 Son

https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/CMN/Cilrhedyn/

Cas

[Glynazard]

Interesting..

Do you know when Thomas first wife died?

Have you looked back on the 1901 for Sarah. She is with the Thomas children. Head is Hannah Davies, which maybe related.

Hannah Davies   84   Head
Sarah Thomas 36 Wife
Elizabeth Thomas 11 Daughter
Thomas Thomas 10 Son
Annie Thomas 7 Daughter
James Thomas 5 Son

Think she married Thomas 1898?

Cas

Yes, so Sarah's maiden name was Davies. Assume Hannah may have been her Mother?

Odd that Thomas Thomas isn't registered as living there. Unsure of the date Thomas first wife (Mary) passed, but they did have 8 children. So looking at this record, it appears that Sarah took on the children.

Still doesn't explain why Thomas Senior isn't there. He profession was as an underground timberman, so wouldn't have been away...