Author Topic: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884  (Read 877 times)

Offline SnowyHog

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Re: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 20 July 24 12:31 BST (UK) »
That is what I was wondering really, as there was a Military Prison in Cork, and a civil prison too, and if his regiment left would he then have gone to Aldershot in England to serve out his sentence in a military prison there.

Offline Andy J2022

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Re: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 20 July 24 12:50 BST (UK) »
If discharged 25 Apr 1884 can he be held under military detention if a civilian?
He was lawfully sentenced and under what we assume was the policy of the time, a sentence of hard labour was to be served in a civil prison. The fact that he was subsequently discharged from the Army (also part of the sentence of the Court Martial) has no bearing on the legitimacy of his sentence of imprisonment. Even if he had not been discharged with ignominy, he would have served his sentence in prison as if he was a civilian and no longer subject to military law. So for example, if he assaulted a prison warder he would have been dealt with under prison regulations, not the Army Act.   Compare this situation with an office worker in a company who is jailed for embezzlement. He would probably also have been sacked by his employer, but that wouldn't make any difference to the carrying out of a prison sentence handed down by the court.

Offline Andy J2022

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Re: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 20 July 24 13:21 BST (UK) »
KRs 1914 is clear that anyone sentenced to imprisonment or hard labour (KRs use the words penal servitude) will serve his sentence in a civil prison. I have no doubt that the same policy applied in the 1880s. Therefore after he was sentenced to hard labour I don't think he would have been held for long in military detention, and he certainly wouldn't have been after his discharge from the Army.

The only exception might have been if he decided to appeal his sentence, in which case it is likely that he would have remained in military detention while the appeal process was underway.  The fact that has sentence was reduced from 5 to 2 years was not as a result of an appeal; it was normal practice to review all Court Martial sentences. He was being punished for a military offence (false enlistment) and since the Court Martial also sentenced him to be discharged there was less of a need to make an example of him for the sake of deterrence, than would have been the case if he had been due to return to the Army after serving his sentence.

Much the same policy applies today. Any soldier awarded a sentence over 2 years is automatically discharged and will serve his sentence in a civilian prison. Those with lower sentences and who are not recommended for discharge, will undergo military detention. Up to about 14 days will be served within the soldier's own unit's guardroom; and sentences between 15 days and two years will usually be served at the Military Corrective Training Centre (MCTC) at Colchester. The regime there is very much the same as a recruit training centre, with the emphasis on rehabilitation and basic military skills.

Offline SnowyHog

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Re: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 20 July 24 13:57 BST (UK) »
I wonder if he was transferred to a civillian prison,  George should then hopefully appear in the prison registers. He doesnt seem to be listed on the Irish prison registers, but there are a few George Stocks on Findmypast prison records it might be worth checking.


Offline SnowyHog

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Re: Military Prison or Civilian Prison 1884
« Reply #13 on: Monday 24 March 25 16:14 GMT (UK) »
Hello all,

I was doing a bit of searching and found a puzzling entry on the Irish Prison Registers 1790-1924

There is an entry of admisson on 6/10/1888 in Cork Prison for a George Stack/Stokes, born Halifax, England. His offences where drunkeness and desertion. His year of birth was 1859, so 3 years out for my Great x 2 Grandad, but still a possibility.

Thoughts anyone?