Something that could help genology

[Ruskie]

I agree that privacy should be protected, but remember that very recent birth, marriage and death records are available on Ancestry, and are probably more useful to anyone with bad intentions than the WW2 service records of a very elderly man or woman.

Regarding access to WW2 service records - if digitised, they are available free here in Australia.I think digitisation is ongoing, though unsure if that is still the case.

Like you Cell, I’m not thrilled that Ancestry have this contract. Would have been nicer if the MOD could have done it themselves as a standalone record set. Probably no money to do so.

[Cell]

You're  entitled  by laws to see them if they fall outside  115 years birth  ( it's 115 years not a 100 years, so many will have to wait a lot longer than 4 years as suggested in a previous reply  (if their ancestor was only 18 years old.).

I recently contacted TNA regarding a military record that was marked closed until 2045 and received the following reply:

"Individuals’ records remain closed for 100 years from their date of birth or until proof of death. In this case, there is no identifiable date of birth on the record, which is why the record is closed under the Freedom of Information Act for 100 years from the date the record was created"

I sent proof of death and received a copy of the file along with confirmation that "under the Freedom of Information Act the documents will be released and become a public record".

I  recieved this below email  from after I contacted them  with the references  ( file  number where it is  and his army number ) the Mod sent out  to me.  Mine falls just outside the 115 years thank goodness ( so no need of his death cert)
I am still waiting for their  email to give me a price so I can pay for it (  I responded  to the.below email just over a week ago confirming that I want to proceed with it)
Kind regards

"Good afternoon,

 

Thank you for your information request to The National Archives.

 
We believe we hold the record for xxxxxx and are handling your request. 

 

Your reference number is -xxxxxxx. Please quote this reference number in future correspondence with regards to your case to enable us to identify your request more easily.

We are handling your request under the Freedom of Information Act 2000. The FOI Act gives you the right to know whether we hold the information you want and to have it communicated to you. 

You can find out more about Freedom of Information on our website: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/foi/

 
As this record is dated to an individual over 115 years old, the search for this record will be subject to our paid search system. 
We estimate the cost for this paid search will be £24.35.

This fee covers the time taken for one of our team to research into the record and for copies of the records to be sent you. Depending on the size of the records, a further charge may apply for copies to be sent to you via email. Large volumes or complex copying will involve a further fee. The prices we charge are set out by the Fees Regulations under the Public Records Act (1958) and are based on recovering the costs of providing the services.  Unfortunately, we cannot give refunds. 

Please note that we cannot guarantee that our search will be successful. The record likely relates to the requested serviceman, but this can only be verified by physically accessing these documents.

 

Due to the early stage of this project, we are unable to facilitate visitors viewing some of these records either on site or online. This is because they need to be stored, indexed and catalogued before they can make their way into our reading rooms.  For information on this transfer project, please see: https://cdn.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documents/mod-service-records-collection-faqs.pdf

Should you wish to proceed with the search, please let us know and you will receive a fees notice giving the full cost of the search you have requested. Once you have received the notice, payment must be made within 3 months, otherwise your request will be closed and you will have to re-apply.

 
Depending on how swiftly payment is made, you should receive copies of the requested record within 20 working days, as laid out in the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
 
Please be aware that this department is currently handling an exceptionally high volume of cases, so it will take us longer than usual to respond to your request.  We will update you regularly on the progress of your case.  To allow us to process cases as efficiently as possible, please note that we will not be able to answer standard queries or hasteners of cases between these updates.  We apologise for the delay and thank you for your continued patience.  For more information, please visit our FAQ page
Yours
Sincerely
Xxxx "

[Cell]

I agree that privacy should be protected, but remember that very recent birth, marriage and death records are available on Ancestry, and are probably more useful to anyone with bad intentions than the WW2 service records of a very elderly man or woman.

Regarding access to WW2 service records - if digitised, they are available free here in Australia.I think digitisation is ongoing, though unsure if that is still the case.

Like you Cell, I’m not thrilled that Ancestry have this contract. Would have been nicer if the MOD could have done it themselves as a standalone record set. Probably no money to do so.

Northern Irish births  aren't, you can only apply to GRONI by mail , for any births under 100 years , you need to know the details  to apply.  Only   England  and Wales are on Ancestry . My grandfather  was Irish. As too many thousands upon thousands who served in the British  Army.
I hate that Ancestry have the contract or any other commercial  company ,  I feel it cheapens those  who served .  My grandfather really  would be appalled.
Kind regards

[Andy J2022]

To be honest I don't think the National Archives have a fully coherent policy on this. Despite what Cell said above, there is no legal requirement for the 115 year embargo. One hundred years is the rule for the release of census information (starting from the date of the census, not date of birth) but that is because it is stipulated in the specific Act of Parliament which authorised the census.
As far as the GDPR and the UK's Data Protection Act 2018 are concerned, once a person has died there is no formal reason the protect their data unless it falls into the special category defined in section 11 of the DPA 2018 - currently that appears to just cover medical information, as mandated by Article 9 (2)(h) of the GDPR which specifies the following as being a special category of personal information which is subject to additional restrictions and handling requirements

processing is necessary for the purposes of preventive or occupational medicine, for the assessment of the working capacity of the employee, medical diagnosis, the provision of health or social care or treatment or the management of health or social care systems and services on the basis of Union or Member State law or pursuant to contract with a health professional and subject to the conditions and safeguards referred to in paragraph 3;

The Freedon of Information Act 2000 operates on a different basis altogether, but even that has special categories of exempt information, such as personal health information, which may be withheld by a public body. However the FOIA does not differentiate between information about living persons and those who have died. The nearest it gets to doing so is to categorise certain exempt information as that which would amount to an actionable breach of confidence by the data subject; a person who has died cannot bring an action for breach of confidence, and neither can his/her representative on his/her behalf.
In other words TNA are being abundantly cautious, basically because they can make up their own rules.

[Ruskie]

Yes, I should have specified England and Wales Cell. I rushed to post and neglected to amend.

Agree with you that Ancestry cheapens it - you know they’re only in it for the profit.