Anybody recognise this officer?

[SiGr]

I’m afraid it is unlikely to be Sir Francis Seymour who died in 1890.

The first medal is almost certainly the 22 June 1897 Queen Victoria Diamond Jubilee Medal. The colours are very slightly off but that is likely a bit of age-discolouring. The photo also appears to have the ‘1897’ silver bar, confirming it is the 1897 Diamond Jubilee Medal. According to Wikipedia, the bar was given to those who had previously been awarded the 1887 medal so this means the man in the photo had also been awarded the 1887 Golden Jubilee Medal. Apparently the 1897 medal was awarded to, “members of the Royal Family and the court, guests at the celebrations of Queen Victoria's diamond jubilee and the soldiers and sailors that paraded that day in London”. Wikipedia states that for 1897 3,040 silver medals were awarded (in the photo the medal is clearly silver, not gold or bronze which were the other versions). So, we just need to find a General who was involved in the 1887 and 1897 Jubilee events, who was also a GCB who served in the Crimea and had the Orders of the Crown and Medjide.

Also, just to reiterate, Sir Francis Seymour died as a KCB, not a GCB. The photo has the sash and badge of a GCB.

So, whoever this portrait is of, he was still alive on 22 June 1897 and had the GCB. And he was one of the 3,040 awarded the silver version of the 1897 Diamond Jubilee Medal (having also received the 1887 version).

One other thing that might help is if the bars on the Crimea Medal painting have any text on them. Rpweedon, can you check and see if there is any text ? If there is, could you transcribe and let us know what each says. The ‘Army List’ used to detail the bars awarded for the Crimea and other campaigns so this would be very useful. Equally, a closer photo of the medals themselves would help.

Regards.

Simon

[Rockford]

I’m afraid it is unlikely to be Sir Francis Seymour who died in 1890.

.........

Also, just to reiterate, Sir Francis Seymour died as a KCB, not a GCB. The photo has the sash and badge of a GCB.

At least that's one general ruled out.

It's interesting that the Wikipedia article has a source for him being advanced to a GCB, when the London Gazette consistently refers to him being KCB showing that, as you say, he died a KCB.

Best wishes

Brian

[SiGr]

Hi, Brian,

I see in The London Gazette of 12 Aug 1890 a reference to, "General Sir Francis Seymour, Bart., K.C.B., deceased", which seems pretty definitive.

The Wikipedia reference you mention states he was advanced to GCB in 1881. Francis Seymour only appeared in the London Gazette once that year. This was to announce the retirement of, "Sir Francis Seymour, Bart., K.C.B., Colonel the Devonshire Regiment".

So, he was never GCB thus discounting him from this search.

Thanks for mentioning this though, It is a good reminder that Wikipedia is not always accurate (whilst still being a marvellous resource).

Simon

[SiGr]

I think we have our man.

General Sir Daniel Lysons GCB.

At Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Lysons_(British_Army_officer)

Also photo at:
https://www.lookandlearn.com/history-images/U324362/The-late-General-Sir-Daniel-Lysons-GCB?t=2&q=General+Sir+Daniel+Lysons

And:
https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/general-sir-daniel-lysons-g-c-b-constab-e-of-h-m-tower-news-photo/464751373

All the medals match up and he looks like the same man.

Simon

[SiGr]

Here is some bio detail as well from 'Armorial Families' of 1895.

[SiGr]

One of the photos for ease of reference.

[SiGr]

And another.

[Rockford]

I don't think it's General Lysons either.

If the portrait that started our quest is true to life, Gen Lysons appears to be at least one battle clasp short on his Crimea Medal.

Best wishes

Brian

[SiGr]

Hi, Brian,

I noticed that and it does bug me. Various Army Lists state Gen. Lysons had three Crimea clasps.

But I was also bugged by the Medjidie award in the photo. The crescent is reversed from the actual award.

The Belgian award painting bugged me further. The Order of the Crown has a green wreath above it to connect to the ribbon. The Order of Leopold has a crown for the same purpose but has only a four pointed star. On the painting it looks like a five-pointed star but with a crown connecting it to the ribbon. That could be a trick of the eye, but I do not see any green paint above the star.

Everything else seems to fit but the above niggles are why I asked the original poster to take better resolution photos. Painters can get things wrong but possibly three things wrong would be a bit of a stretch. Unless they were working from notes after just one or two sittings.

All that said, I can't imagine there being that may Generals with a GCB (in itself a very rare grade even in Victorian times), the Medjidie award, the Crimea medal and the Belgian award.

Attached also is an 1882 portrait of Sir Daniel Lysons. I have to say, he looks very similar.

But, as always, happy to be shown as having got it wrong.

Simon