Author Topic: Cheetham County Gaol  (Read 2224 times)

Offline BlandTree

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Cheetham County Gaol
« on: Tuesday 20 December 22 17:49 GMT (UK) »
I have very recently found the birth certificate for my paternal grandmother, Alice BERRY, who was born on 7th May 1870 in County Gaol,Cheetham. 

However, I have had no luck in finding anything about this gaol. I know that Strangeways is situated on Cheetham Hill but research indicates that Strangeways, built in 1868, replaced New Bailey Gaol.  Furthermore, the only alternative names that I have found for Strangeways are Salford County Gaol and Manchester prison (its new name after the riots destroyed part of Strangeways).

Elzabeth BERRY was admitted to County Gaol,Cheethaml on 27th April 1870 for stealing two linen shirts and had been sentenced to two calendar month Hard Labour.  She gave birth to my grandmother Alice just ten days later and was released on 30th June 1870.  Alice BERRY's birth was registered in prison on 19th May 1870.
https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBPRS%2FMAN%2F4510373%2F00329.JOIN&parentid=GBPRS%2FA%2F62003265%2F1

Can anyone tell me anything about County Gaol,Cheetham  its whereabouts, history or photographs of the building?

Also, what will have happened to the baby? Would Alice have stayed in gaol with her mother? How would that work if her mother was doing "Hard Labour"?
In the 1881 census Elizabeth BERRY is shown with four children and Alice is named as Alice RAWLINSON (widow's child) and her father, Thomas RAWLINSON is lodging with her in Elizabeth BERRY's house in Worsley.  Thomas is definitely Alice's father, proved by DNA matches.

Any help or suggestions would be very gratefully received!
Adkins, Alford, Alfred, Allford, Armitt, Atkins, Atkinson, Berry, Blackberry. Blackbury, BLAND, Boaden, Boardman, Bowden, Carpenter, Lister, Malsbury, Mason, McAra, Mawle, Mery, Mold, Newth, Pargitter, Park, Pritchard, Quiney, Quinney, Rawlinson, Rollinson, Rowlinson, Rowledge, Sprute, Stuart, Sugden, Tyler

Offline emeltom

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 20 December 22 18:50 GMT (UK) »
Googling County Gaol Cheetham brings up entries for Strangeways so I would say that it was an early name for Strangeways.
Smith Tiplady Boulton Branthwaite King Miller Woolfall Bretherton Archer and many more

Online heywood

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 20 December 22 19:22 GMT (UK) »
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline BlandTree

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 20 December 22 23:30 GMT (UK) »
Thank you, emeltom, and I agree (and did that frst), but none of the several links to Strangeways mentions the County Gaol, Cheetham, even though other gaols, such as Salford County Jail and New Bailey Gaol, are mentioned. 
Strangeways, as I wrote above, opened in 1868 and my grandmother was born in 1870 and the birth certificate specifies "County Gaol, Cheetham".  Strangeways was named "Strangeways" (named for Stangeways Park), from the date of its opening so why would the Registrar name it "County Gaol, Cheetham"?  Unless I can find at least one primary source proving that Strangeways was also known as County Court, Cheetham, I cannot accept that they are one & the same gaol.

Thank you, heywood, and I had already found that too but again it mentions other gaols connected to Strangeway but not the County Gaol, Cheetham.  Having said that, the image I have of Elizabeth BERRY's commital to County Gaol, Cheetham, does mention the Bolton, Salford & Manchester Assizes but those assizes sent offenders to other prisons too.

If my grandmother was in Strangeways two years after it had opened I find it hard to believe that the Registrar of Births entered the prison through those impressive gates with the name clearly visible and  called it County Gaol, Cheetham.  That, in a nutshell is why I asked the question! 
And I really am very grateful to you both for looking at this for me.

Malcolm
Adkins, Alford, Alfred, Allford, Armitt, Atkins, Atkinson, Berry, Blackberry. Blackbury, BLAND, Boaden, Boardman, Bowden, Carpenter, Lister, Malsbury, Mason, McAra, Mawle, Mery, Mold, Newth, Pargitter, Park, Pritchard, Quiney, Quinney, Rawlinson, Rollinson, Rowlinson, Rowledge, Sprute, Stuart, Sugden, Tyler


Offline Bookbox

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 20 December 22 23:49 GMT (UK) »
Manchester Times, Saturday 15 August 1868
ESCAPE FROM THE NEW COUNTY GAOL. – On Sunday morning, a prisoner, named George Roe, 24 years of age, awaiting trial at the approaching sessions, effected his escape from the new county gaol, Strangeways, and has not since  been heard of since …

ADDED
There are several other similar entries in the newspapers.

Offline Bookbox

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 21 December 22 01:14 GMT (UK) »
There are two separate records for your Elizabeth Berry on FindMyPast. The one you have flagged up in your first post is labelled ‘Manchester Strangeways Prison – Female Register’. A separate record, giving some of the same information, is labelled ‘Manchester Strangeways Prison – Female Description Book’. Both have an archive reference beginning M600/3 …

The Manchester Archives online catalogue confirms that M600/3 is the collection Strangeways Prison, Southall Street (H.M. Prison Manchester).

If my grandmother was in Strangeways two years after it had opened I find it hard to believe that the Registrar of Births entered the prison through those impressive gates with the name clearly visible and  called it County Gaol, Cheetham.

The information written by registrars into the ‘When and Where Born column’ of birth registers was strictly prescribed. ‘Cheetham’ -- a registration sub-district and civil parish -- would be the official descriptor to be used for that particular location, regardless of what the registrar may have seen on the prison gates.

If, despite the advice given on this thread, you are still doubtful, perhaps you should contact Manchester Archives, who hold the original records, and ask them to confirm the name of the prison in which Elizabeth Berry was held.

Online heywood

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 21 December 22 04:58 GMT (UK) »
https://www.manchester.gov.uk/directory_record/212407/prison_records/category/1367/view_all_collections

Scroll to the entry for Strangeways.

From the above

Strangeways Prison

Located in Southall Street, this prison was built to replace New Bailey prison in Salford which closed in June 1868. It acted as the County Gaol for the Hundred of Salford (south-east Lancashire).

Added
There are several newspaper snippets around that time and later which refer to County Gaol, Strangeways.

As Bookbox points out the district was Cheetham.
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Offline BlandTree

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 22 December 22 13:19 GMT (UK) »
Thank you all, that's brilliant!
Looking back at the certificate I realise, thanks to to you, the significance of the word order!  Now I understand the importance of the words "County Gaol" meaning Strangeways, and the separate word, "Cheetham" referring only to the registration district!  And that is why Googling "Cheetham County Gaol" produces no results... because no such place existed!  Sorry to have been so dense!
RootsChat experts come up with the solution yet again!
Thank you for your time & patience emeltom, heywood & Bookbox. :)
Adkins, Alford, Alfred, Allford, Armitt, Atkins, Atkinson, Berry, Blackberry. Blackbury, BLAND, Boaden, Boardman, Bowden, Carpenter, Lister, Malsbury, Mason, McAra, Mawle, Mery, Mold, Newth, Pargitter, Park, Pritchard, Quiney, Quinney, Rawlinson, Rollinson, Rowlinson, Rowledge, Sprute, Stuart, Sugden, Tyler

Online heywood

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Re: Cheetham County Gaol
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 22 December 22 13:28 GMT (UK) »
Now it’s Manchester prison  but some of us still call it Strangeways but we know what is meant. Probably the same back then.
It’s good that you are now settled in your mind about it. ;)
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk