Finding birth record

[sophiamarina]

All the information on the 1910 marriage certificate should include all details about the bride...also witnesses names...church married in.......

If you have relevant comments about the information on the certificate, you should place them after the information.

You have the document, people on this forum do not have access to the document. We only know what you tell us about the information on the marriage certificate.

Bride is Gladys Fogwell and the witnesses were her mother and her brother. Her family go back hundreds of years in that local area, working on the land. It's the groom who is a stranger in that area with no apparent links to it, and no witness from his side. The shoe shop chain he worked for seem to have sent him to various branches around the south west and south Wales over the years, so he's a bit of a rolling stone in the landscape here...

[wivenhoe]

Ancestry
1901 Census Wales  at 18 Rawson Parade St Mary West Cardiff
WHITTINGTON John                54y retired farmer           b. Preston Baggett Warwick
WHITTINGTON Caroline M A    44y  wife dressmaker       b. Worster, Worstershire
OLIVER John *                        25y   bootshop ass.  single   b. Loughborough Leister
MORRIS John                          *5y  bootshop ass.   single   b. Flintshire Mold
CRABBE Walter P                     24y cycle fitter single          b. Swansea Glamorgan   

[heatherjulie]

1901
18 Rawdon Place, Cardiff
John Whittington Head m 54 born Warwickshire Retired Farmer
Caroline M A Whittington m Wife 44 born Worcestershire Dressmaker
John R Oliver Boarder 25 s born Leicestershire Boot and Shop Assistant
John Morris Boarder 25 s  born Mold Flintshire Boot and Shop Assistant
Walter P Crabbe Boarder 21s born Glamorgan Cycle Fitter
John S Johnson   Boarder 20 s born Glamorgan  Manager of Provision Shop
RG13/4985/112/63

[sophiamarina]

That's the one! One of the other boarders looks to be a colleague, but other than that there are no apparent links to anyone.

[heatherjulie]

One to look into
There is a marriage
Edith Emma Mardon and John Morris in April/May/June1902 Exeter Devon.
There is a death for Edith Emma Morris in December 1902 Exeter Devonshire

[sophiamarina]

One to look into
There is a marriage
Edith Emma Mardon and John Morris in April/May/June1902 Exeter Devon.
There is a death for Edith Emma Morris in December 1902 Exeter Devonshire

Oh that's very interesting - thank you! I might order that marriage cert and see what it says.

[MonicaL]

With the John in 1901 showing a birth place of Mold, Flintshire, have you considered this 1881 census entry in Mold? Everyone showing as born in Mold except mother Sarah:

John Morris 40 Farmer 80 Acres
Sarah Morris 35 b. Llangollen, Denbighshire
Catharine Morris 15
John Morris 8
Jane Morris 6
Anne Morris 2
Thomas Jones 16

Monica

ADDED: No, can't be the right John. The John above is busy helping his dad on the farm in 1901.

[Mabel Bagshawe]

He says "Rhuabon" in 1911 - there's a few the right sort of age in that area in earlier years

He might be a bit older than he claims. Edith Emma Morris who dies in 1902 was b c1868, and appears on 1901 to be a widow

[sophiamarina]

Thanks MonicaL, it did look vaguely familiar so I knew I'd probably considered and rejected it, and it must have been for the reason in your postscript! Maddening, isn't it - such a common name in that part of the country.

I've ordered that first wedding certificate from 1902, so I'm hoping there might be a clue about his father there - maybe an occupation or first name, even if he fudged the surname (I've seen this pattern on other wedding certificates of illegitimate children). The fact that no details beyond "deceased" were given in 1910 really does scream "illegitimate" to me, though perhaps the transcription could be a factor?