Henry Watson

[smithy]

Lu, On the birth certificate of his son Gordon and the electoral rolls he is Henry., Gordon gives his fathers name as George (occupation Carpenter) on his marriage certificate to Vera Doreen Lindsay, so I guess my assumption was perhaps both names were used being first and second names....and I know we shouldn't assume!

[shanreagh]

Or perhaps Gordon did not know his father's exact legal name.  You say that you have lost track of Henry Watson ie that you cannot find him on later rolls after 1924 when Gordon would have been 11.

Perhaps the father's occupation was not really known either....I can understand traveller and farmer being the same person, as in those days NZers were often not far (generation-wise) from a rural upbringing.   Though needs must in those times of uncertainty in the late 1930s.   

[Lucy2]

And more questions  re: VIC birth certificate for 1913   : 

Q.    Does the cert. give the Father's place of birth  ??

Q.    And does it confirm that the mother, Frances was born in NZ  ...  and where  ??[/b]

   ~  Lu   

These questions ^  from earlier, still need answers if you can,  please Carol ?

    ~   Lu

Added ... highlighting so this doesn't get missed.   

   

[minniehaha]

Part quote:

"You say that you have lost track of Henry Watson ie that you cannot find him on later rolls after 1924 when Gordon would have been 11."

1926…… ??

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/232269050?searchTerm=henry%20watson


Minniehaha.

[shanreagh]

Well if that is the correct Henry that explains the non appearance on the rolls.  Op when you have found Frances on later rolls what does she give as her status ie 'widow' and on her death certificate is she noted as 'widow'? 

ETA Noting that she is 'home duties' on these ones
1935,1936,1937,1949 @ Selby Victoria
But what for 1942 and on her death certificate?

[shanreagh]

Did Gordon Sinclair go to WW11?  Have you checked the Aus Defence Rolls?

What was Gordon Watson's exact date of birth please? 

[Lucy2]

On various Electoral Rolls for Victoria Australia:
Henry & Fanny Watson Sale Victoria occupation; Traveller on the 1913,
 Henry & Frances Sale Victoria 1914,1915 Rolls
The next I have is Henry & Frances Jumbuk occupation: Farmer 1924
that is the only ones I can be sure that's the Henry Watson I'm researching.

Frances Watson is on 1935,1936,1937,1949 @ Selby Victoria home duties with her son Gordon St. Clare Watson.

On the 1942 Roll she is still in Selby living by herself.

On the 1949 Electoral Roll she is once again with her son In Morwell Victoria.

Hi Carol ... when giving Electoral info, could you please state the name of the actual Electorate ?
Lots of viewers for example, won't know where "Selby" is.  (I've lived in Victoria so a few place names make sense.)   But I was surprised to find "Selby" was in >
Electorate of "Flinders" > "Ferntree Gully"  -- and that information was helpful to me in looking for other things connected to this search.

Here's Frances and son Gordon St Clare WATSON in 1954 >
VIC >  McMillan >  Morwell   ... both living at 61 Comans Street - he's a mechanic / she's listed as F. (Female)  "h.d.  (home duties).

   ~  Lu

[Lucy2]

Lu, On the birth certificate of his son Gordon and the electoral rolls he is Henry., Gordon gives his fathers name as George (occupation Carpenter) on his marriage certificate to Vera Doreen Lindsay, so I guess my assumption was perhaps both names were used being first and second names....and I know we shouldn't assume!

Hi again

It does seem that Gordon probably had little knowledge of his father - and maybe that's strange if he spent so many years living with, or near to, his mother Frances.   It just seems odd ... although some people, did keep "family stories/secrets etc" well hidden.   

As well as your finds of Henry (traveller) and Fanny WATSON on Electoral rolls 1913/ 1914/ 1915, at Sale, Victoria, I have also found  Henry WATSON, traveller and Fanny WATSON, home duties on another 1913 Electoral roll in Victoria.
    It seems that AUS e/rolls differ from those of New Zealand in that in NZ we can often find if names were removed from rolls when persons shifted to another location during an election year ??
SO ... I can only assume the Henry (traveller) and Fanny WATSON on the 1913 VIC > Gippsland
 > listing that I have found, are the same people who are at Sale in 1913 ?

1913 - VIC > Gippsland > Bairnsdale :
WATSON - Fanny - h. d.
WATSON - Henry - traveller  both at Main Street, Bairnsdale.

Now, not sure if the following helps in establishing a connection to the "Frances ROWNTREE - bc 1872 NZ ??

In the aforementioned Electorate (Gippsland > Bairnsdale) in the very next year -- 1914 -- the following people are resident :

1914
BROOKS - Hannah Casson  [* - a sister of the  1872 NZ-born Frances ROWNTREE ]
BROOKS - Charles William  - [her husband ] - commission agent
 and     Edward Casson ROWNTREE - joiner  - [ - the father of Hannah and Frances ]
                        ....     all are residing at Main Street, Bairnsdale.
[*   my notes are in italics ]

   ~   Lu
                                                            continues next post  > >

[Lucy2]

ROWNTREE etc. continued >

I don't want to bog down this thread with a lot of info on the ROWNTREE family because that's not really who you are searching for  ... except to add the following background info which may aid in finding when Frances (and possibly Henry WATSON*) travelled to AUS. 
[ *  Note:   No evidence that Henry WATSON was ever in NZ, aside from his stating a 1906 marriage to Frances in NZ].

*   Edward Casson ROWNTREE is well documented and fairly easily found in newspapers mentions.
He married Hannah Winnyfred (sic) BUTTON at Hobart, Tasmania - 25/12/1858.    He was in Otago province, NZ, by 1862 at least - made bankrupt at some stage - and advertising himself as an Architect and Surveyor.   Electoral listings show him as "Builder" or  " Carpenter" at various times.

*   A daughter Eva ROWNTREE (Evalina ?) married in Oct. 1899 (to Walter Richard BLACKBURN) at her parents residence, at Fairfield Park, VIC.    Unknown when Edward etc. returned to NZ but when his son Frank Chilton ROWNTREE married in VIC 1906, notice said his father "MR E C ROWNTREE lived in Wellington NZ."
*    In 1908 the ROWNTREEs (Edward, wife Hannah and some children) are on the Wellington > Hutt > e/roll,  residing at Petone (nr Lower Hutt).

*  Frances ROWNTREE seems to still be in NZ but moving around different localities in years 1908 / 1911.  (No occupation shown for her and named as "Francis ... - a spinster"  on some rolls (that being the male spelling of her forename.) 
*   Edward's wife Hannah Winifred ROWNTREE died at Wellington NZ in Auguust 1932.

*   Edward Casson ROWNTREE died at the home of his daughter (Hannah Casson - Mrs BROOKS) in Victoria, in 1922.     Can't see any probate documents for these people ... or death notices that might reveal a direct connection to Frances WATSON.

*  The sister Eva BLACKBURN and husband returned to NZ to live (husb. d. 1949 at Auckland).
*  Sister, Hannah Casson ROWNTRE, married Charles William BROOKS - 1892 - VIC.

SO other than the fact the the WATSONs  / BROOKS and Edward C. ROWNTREE lived in the same location just year apart and that E C ROWNTREE (possibly Gordon's grandfather ?? ) was a "carpenter", I can't really offer any more.   

Our NZ BDM is undergoing maintenance at present so some difficulty exists in trying to confirm certain items.

   ~  Lu

PS :    I'll keep the notes I have gathered for ROWNTREE in case you need further info.

ALso, sorry for the big GAP in this post - have tried to correct it but HUGE advertisements keep creeping in.