Author Topic: Latin translation of Parish marriage record  (Read 620 times)

Offline DB10

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Latin translation of Parish marriage record
« on: Thursday 08 July 21 14:00 BST (UK) »
Hi all. I have a record of the marriage of my GGGF John Sullivan. I have the copy of the civil registration and have just found on FindMyPast the parish records for Dockhead Bermondsey which will give me both sets of parents  ;D
I have found John in 1851 census living with his mother (Margaret) in Wright Buildings Bermondsey which is the same address as the marriage certificate.
Im just a bit confused as the parish record transcription has residence as Hiberniae but the certificate has their residence as Bermondsey.
Attached is a copy of the Parish entry. Have the transcribers confused residence with place of birth?

Thanks for any learned help.

DB10
Please don't use my restores without my permission - thankyou. 😎

Offline Bookbox

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Re: Latin translation of Parish marriage record
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 08 July 21 16:14 BST (UK) »
The essentials are ...

8 October 1854, at Bermondsey, no lawful impediment found.
John Sullivan, son of William and Margaret Sullivan of Ireland
Helen/Ellen Crow, daughter of James and Mary Crow of Ireland
witnesses – Blakney Gubbins (of the Borough) and Ann Hughes (of Bermondsey).

These Southwark registers often give 'Ireland' as a family's place of origin. Sometimes you get lucky and get a parish and county as well, but unfortunately not here.

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Latin translation of Parish marriage record
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 08 July 21 16:17 BST (UK) »
"Hiberniae" is after names of parents so may mean parents lived there. Have you compared it with entries for marriages of other Irish couples around same time? I think it was abode of parents. Logically therefore probably also birthplace of groom & bride.
Information in entries in Catholic marriage registers seems to vary depending on the priest. A priest might even have changed his format during his tenure.

For comparison some examples of marriages of Irish people from Catholic registers in England in mid-19th century in parishes with which I'm familiar. Transcriptions on Lancashire Online Parish Clerks.

St. Marie, Bury, Lancashire. Marriage register 1834-1867 and 1867-1885
www.lan-opc.org.uk/Bury/Bury/stmarie/index.html
Marriage  Register 1834-1867
Some entries state abode of both groom and bride as places in Ireland. Some give abode of parents. Abode of many parents was Ireland; town, city or county given for some. Information and format not consistent. Both parents were named for many early marriages. Fathers' names & abodes in 1849 & 1850. 
Marriage Register 1867-1885
Both parents named in some early entries. 3 sets of parents were " of Hibernia" in 1867 and some more in 1868.

St. Joseph, Bury
www.lan-opc.org.uk/Bury/Bury/stjoseph/index.html
Founded 1850s.
Marriage Register 1863-1902
Early entries in this register state abodes of groom & bride, names of fathers but not generally their abode, often addresses of witnesses.

St. Mary., Bacup, Lancashire
www.lan-opc.org.uk/Rossendale/Bacup/stmary/index.html
Marriage Register 1854-1902
Information in early entries varied and was often sparse. 1854 names of groom & bride, fathers' names (often no forename of fathers in 1854 & 55), witness names. Began adding abodes of groom, bride and witnesses mid 1855.








Cowban

Offline DB10

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Re: Latin translation of Parish marriage record
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 08 July 21 17:03 BST (UK) »
Thankyou Bookbox, excellent work as always - I got no further than amo, amas, amat in latin  ;D

I have had a look at a few other entries and there are at least two different hands on the page I have downloaded, and you are right different priests give varying amounts of information.
The one who entered this marriage uses the same format in the other marriage he entered but the other hand gives slightly more detail of address including the abode of witnesses down to street address!

I'm now happy that this the right marriage and have a further set of names to investigate in Ireland - that's not going to be easy  ::)

Many thanks once again

DB10
Please don't use my restores without my permission - thankyou. 😎


Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Latin translation of Parish marriage record
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 08 July 21 18:47 BST (UK) »

I'm now happy that this the right marriage and have a further set of names to investigate in Ireland - that's not going to be easy  ::)
/quote]

My step-grandmother's family was from a parish in County Dublin whose marriage register included names of father & mother + their address. My own grandmother was from a parish in County Mayo where the marriage register didn't name parents or even give abode of bride or groom. 
Cowban