David Jeffrey - Scotland (1880s)

[ruthhelen]

This appears to be the family in 1891 in Cupar, Fife:

1891
23 Burnside, Cupar

Maggie Reid, head, charwoman, 27, East Kilbride, Lanarkshire
Annie Scott, daughter, 7, Perth, Perthshire
Mary R Scott, daughter, 6, Edinburgh
Robert R Scott, son, 2, Paisley, Renfrewshire
John R Scott, son, 1, Perth, Perthshire
Maggie R Scott, daughter, 3 mo, Cupar, Fife

And in 1901, in Perth:

1901
12 Pauls Close, Perth

Wm Scott, head, labourer, 39, Cupar, Fife
Maggie Scott, wife, 39, East Kilbride, Renfrewshire (sic)
Anne Scott, daughter, 18, Perth, Perthshire
Mary Scott, daughter, 16, Edinburgh
Robert Scott, son, 15, Paisley, Renfrewshire
John Scott, son, 12, Perth, Perthshire
Maggie Scott, daughter, 10, Cupar, Fife
Agnes E Scott, daughter, 7, Cupar, Fife
Wm Scott, son, 6, East Kilbride, Renfrewshire (sic)
David C Scott, son, 2, Calderbank, Lanarkshire

Ruth

[ruthhelen]

Well, I'm nowhere near finding the elusive David Jeffrey, but William Scott was an interesting character   

William Scott was a soldier from Cupar, stationed in Hamilton when he married Maggie Reid in 1880 in East Kilbride. I imagine he was moved around a bit, although I'm not completely sure how many of the 8 children with him and Maggie in 1901 in Perth are actually his.

I can't find them in 1881, but at some point after his marriage he was posted to Seaforth, Lancashire - it doesn't look like Maggie went with him, because by 1887, he had met and married Mary Elizabeth Lea in Lancashire, declaring himself single.... He left the army, and he and his new wife moved to Dundee, where Maggie Reid (to whom he was still legally married), who was living in Cupar, found out. She prosecuted, and he was convicted of bigamy at Bootle in May 1889 and sentenced to 18 months in prison... 

So, it seems likely that he was still in prison in 1891, and none of the children with Maggie Reid in Cupar (with the possible exception of the first child, Ann) are actually William Scott's. I imagine he was required to return to his wife on leaving prison, so I guess the three children with them in 1901 could be his...

As I say, not helping with finding David Jeffrey, but still.... I guess he could have been another soldier... 

Ruth

[ruthhelen]

No further forward with trying to track down David Jeffrey, but have been exploring the complicated history of Robert Jeffrey Reid or Scott’s mother - Maggie Reid and her mother, Ann Smith or Reid.

Part 1: Maggie Reid

Maggie Reid was born Margaret Allan Smith in 1863 in East Kilbride, to Ann Smith or Reid (who was the daughter of Margaret Gourlay and her first husband, James Smith. Margaret Gourlay subsequently married John Reid). It seems likely that her father’s surname was Allan - her mother had a number of illegitimate children, and there are two that potentially have their father’s surnames as middle names.

Maggie Reid or Smith had eight children - four probably with William Scott, who she married in 1880 in East Kilbride: Ann Scott b. 1883, Perth; Agnes Elizabeth Scott b. 1893, Cupar; William Scott b. 1895, East Kilbride; and David Charles Scott b. 1899, Old Monkland.

In the years while William Scott was stationed in England (and indulging in his other marriage) Maggie had four further children: Mary Jeffrey Reid, b. 1885, Edinburgh; Robert Jeffrey Reid or Scott, b. 1886, Paisley; John Reid or Scott b. 1888, Perth; Margaret Reid or Scott, b. 1890, Cupar.

We know that the first two are not William Scott’s children (Maggie even stated such to the registrar when Robert’s birth was registered, saying she hadn’t had marital relations with her husband for at least five years), and we have to assume that the other two aren’t either - William Scott married his second wife in 1887, and was convicted of bigamy in 1889.

Maggie died in Perth in 1934 - her death was registered by her son, David Charles Scott. She is noted as being a widow. I can’t find a definitive death for William Scott - he isn’t with the family in 1911 in Perth, with Maggie (who is noted as being married) and two of her children: David Charles Scott and Margaret Reid or Scott - so we could assume he died some time between 1911 and 1934.

Ruth

[ruthhelen]

Part 2: Ann Smith or Reid

Maggie’s mother, Ann Smith or Reid, has an equally chequered history. She was born in Ireland in about 1839 to Margaret Gourlay and her first husband, James Smith. She first appears in Scotland in 1851 in Glassford, Lanarkshire with her mother and her second husband, John Reid, along with three siblings.

Her first child, Eliza Simpson, was born in 1856 in Glassford. She subsequently married the child’s father, Matthew Simpson, in Feb 1857 in East Kilbride. Their second child, Jane Simpson was born in December 1857 in East Kilbride. Matthew Simpson seems to have left the household shortly after - he appears in 1861 in Corstophine, Midlothian, where he appears to afterwards take up with a Mary Moran, with whom he has three further children: James in 1862, and Henry and John (twins) in 1869. He died in 1879 in Colinton, Midlothian.

Ann Smith had five children between 1861 and 1870 - presumably all to different fathers (none of whom were her husband): Mary Ann Smith b. 1861; Margaret Allan Smith, b. 1863, Elizabeth Smith, b. 1865; Rachel Smith, b. 1867; and Agnes Barclay Smith, b. 1870.

She then had a son - registered as David Smith, in 1872 - with David Thomas, a soldier stationed at Hamilton. She married David Thomas in 1880 (when, if we remember, her daughter Maggie Reid married William Scott, also a soldier stationed at Hamilton). He appears in barracks at Hamilton in 1881, and I can’t find the family at all in 1891, but Ann registered David Thomas’ death in 1900 in Perth. She died in 1907 in Perth.

Ruth

[vardaeus]

Hi everyone,

I've only just seen the replies on this thread! Thanks everyone for your contributions. I've found the Paisley poorhouse record for Maggie Reid/Scott, which was put together when she arrived on 9 June 1886. It lists David Jeffrey as the "putative father" of Mary Jeffrey Reid (b. 1885) and, given the proximity of births and similarity in names, it is very likely that he is also the father of Robert Jeffrey Reid/Scott (b. 1886). Unfortunately, this is all the information I have on David.

Ruth - thank you for the work you've put into this! All of the information you've put here is greatly appreciated and I'll spend some time going over it. It's certainly helped to fill in some gaps that I had, and confirm some other theories.

The bigamy case information is correct. William Scott was station at Seaforth and subsequently married Mary Elizabeth Lea. After the marriage and the birth of their son, the pair moved to Dundee. Maggie heard about this and travelled to confront her 'successor'. I believe William did 18 months with hard labour for it, potentially explaining his absence from the 1891 census. In addition, your hunch about the 1901 Census is correct: that is the right family and all the children are listed as William's, but only those born in the 1890s are registered as his.

As you'll see, the confusion only worsens. According to the poorhouse record, Maggie was under the impression that William was dead: "Margt. Reid, widow... married 24 September 1880 in East Kilbride. Has been told husband was killed in Egypt 4 years ago." The problem is that she doesn't say that her husband is dead on future birth records, only that she has not had relations with him for years.

It also lists her mother, Anne Smith - living at 32 W. Mill St, Perth - and a father, John Reid, who is deceased.


Again, thank you for your help with all of this and I'll have a proper look through!

- Reagan

[Fogmoose]

Part 2: Ann Smith or Reid

Maggie’s mother, Ann Smith or Reid, has an equally chequered history. She was born in Ireland in about 1839 to Margaret Gourlay and her first husband, James Smith. She first appears in Scotland in 1851 in Glassford, Lanarkshire with her mother and her second husband, John Reid, along with three siblings.

Her first child, Eliza Simpson, was born in 1856 in Glassford. She subsequently married the child’s father, Matthew Simpson, in Feb 1857 in East Kilbride. Their second child, Jane Simpson was born in December 1857 in East Kilbride. Matthew Simpson seems to have left the household shortly after - he appears in 1861 in Corstophine, Midlothian, where he appears to afterwards take up with a Mary Moran, with whom he has three further children: James in 1862, and Henry and John (twins) in 1869. He died in 1879 in Colinton, Midlothian.

Ann Smith had five children between 1861 and 1870 - presumably all to different fathers (none of whom were her husband): Mary Ann Smith b. 1861; Margaret Allan Smith, b. 1863, Elizabeth Smith, b. 1865; Rachel Smith, b. 1867; and Agnes Barclay Smith, b. 1870.

She then had a son - registered as David Smith, in 1872 - with David Thomas, a soldier stationed at Hamilton. She married David Thomas in 1880 (when, if we remember, her daughter Maggie Reid married William Scott, also a soldier stationed at Hamilton). He appears in barracks at Hamilton in 1881, and I can’t find the family at all in 1891, but Ann registered David Thomas’ death in 1900 in Perth. She died in 1907 in Perth.

Ruth

Ruth, you are a wonder! I love reading your research finds, I only love it more when they are MY ancestors! Best of the Best health to you and your family!!

Richard (Fogmoose)