Missing Gallagher Marriage

[macpark]

The marriage certificate that you have for GALLAGHER - PAXTON  31 May 1918 - can you please list all the information on this document. Everything please, for bride and groom.....ages, addresses, occupations....names of witnesses....everything.

What names do you have for children of this marriage?

The marriage took place at St Andrew's Church of Scotland(now demolished,) Greenside Ave., in Berwick upon Tweed on 31st May 1918

She was a spinster (25) & he was a widower (31). James was shown as an Iron Dresser.
She lived at 17 Yard Heads, Tweedmouth and he at 279 Bernard St., Bridgeton, Glasgow
His parents were Frederick Gallagher, Electrical Engineer Labourer(1855-1925) & Margaret Smith (1863 - ?) and her parents were Robert Miller Paxton, Flour Miller(1860-1925) & Mary Lindores (1860-1938)
The witnesses were Frederick Gallagher, (I assume this to be) the groom's youngest brother b1896)
and Ethel Miller Paxton, the bride's youngest sister b.1901

The children of the marriage were Fred G, Mary Lindores G, Isabella Hussey G (my mother) and James G Jr.

There are no military records for James as he was in a reserved occupation, working his whole life for Barr and Stroud.  They were optical engineers and switched to making such things as range finders for the Armed forces.  See attached:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barr_and_Stroud

[macpark]

Is this the alleged death of James?
1967
GALLAGHER, JAMES
Age at death 80
Ref 644/4 713
RD Name Glasgow

Back in 1918, on the Glasgow ER, James Gallagher seems to be listed at the family home, 279 Bernard Street.
Iron dresser (parliamentary voter only)

This is not alleged.  It is definitely him.  He died at the home of his youngest son in East Kilbride, Glasgow.

[macpark]

Hi macpark,

Do you know the date of death for James? Death certificate might hopefully show name of first wife. 

Regards,
Andrea

I don't think that Scottish death certificates would list that, and I don't think my uncle would have known the name of his father's first wife.  I'm not even sure my mother knew because it was never mentioned and none of my cousins knew until I ordered the marriage certificate that he was a widower when he married our grandmother.

[Forfarian]

I don't think that Scottish death certificates would list that

Yes, they do.

A Scottish death certificate normally lists the names of all spouses, including the maiden surnames of all wives, but of course the information is only as good as the informant's knowledge and if the informant did not know that the deceased had been married more than once this information could not be included.

[jonwarrn]

Yes, but a man's death certificate doesn't usually name his wife, and certainly not her maiden name.

No one said they did.
We are talking about the first wife of James Gallagher.

Added
From 1969 a married woman's (or widows) maiden name is given on her death cert in Eng + Wales.
Back in the 1910s not so lucky!

[Forfarian]

Yes, but a man's death certificate doesn't usually name his wife, and certainly not her maiden name.

No one said they did.

No, but someone has been muddying the issue by talking about the information on a married woman's death certificate.

I am talking about the first wife of James Gallagher.

I am talking about the fact that a Scottish death certificate routinely gives the names of all spouses of the deceased, including the maiden surnames of all wives the informant knows about, whereas an English man's death certificate does not normally name even the current or most recent wife, let alone give her maiden surname. Therefore if the death of the husband is registered in Scotland, that is normally the quickest and easiest way to find the first wife's name, unless the informant did not know her name, in which case you have to find the death certificate of the wife without knowing her name at all, which is much more of a challenge.

As the person being looked for is, as you say, James Gallagher's first wife, this is highly relevant.

From 1969 a married woman's (or widows) maiden name is given on her death cert in Eng + Wales. Back in the 1910s not so lucky!

From 1855, a married woman's death certificate in Scotland names all her husbands and her parents, including her mother's maiden surname, assuming of course that this information was known to the informant. You will understand that, being familar with the information recorded in Scotland, I am rather underwhelmed to learn that a married woman's maiden surname was not included in England and Wales until 114 years later

[macpark]

Sadly. 1st wife is not named on the death certificate.

[Forfarian]

Oh dear

It'll be back to looking at those marriages then, I fear.

[mclachlan]

Not sure if you've started looking through the marriages but I had a few spare credits so you can eliminate the following from your list! (This is on the assumption James' first wife died in Scotland, which she may not have.)

Mary Ellen McGartland    1913     Camlachie
Janet Tighe                    1916     Calton
Mary Steele                   1915     Anderston

I forgot to check, as Forfarian suggested, whether there were any death records as well for any of the above, until after I had looked at the certificates, but I'll put that down to Covid brain! (still in lockdown in Melbourne, Australia and have no idea what day, date or month it is!!  ).

Having since checked, I can't see any death records for them during that time frame of 1911-1918.

Regards,
Andrea