Author Topic: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/  (Read 20227 times)

Offline Guy Etchells

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #99 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:19 BST (UK) »

Sorry Ray but you are totally wrong as the guidance specifically includes -
"for any medical reason, to donate blood, avoid injury or illness, escape risk of harm, provide care or help a vulnerable person"

The reason for leaving London was covered by the above.

Guy - could you tell me which of the above is the reason DC went to Durham?  If it is 'for any medical reason' I would assume that meant either to visit a local doctor or hospital preferably in an ambulance.  Maybe I'm wrong on this point and most people would consider the best doctor/hospital is 260 miles away.   'Donating blood' has not been mentioned.  'Avoid injury or illness'?  I think the opposite was more likely to happen.  'Escape risk or harm'?  This is supposedly due to the mob outside his house.  Surely a phone call to the police would have been easier.  'Provide care'?  Again, not mentioned.  'Help a vulnerable person'?  Again not mentioned.

Please explain
Rishile

If you watch the daily press briefings you will have heard Dr Jenny Harries mention on a number of occasions the guidelines clearly state the exemption would be the "Escape risk or harm" if his wife was suffering from the virus and Dominic Cummings caught it he could become incapacitated very quickly leaving their son at risk of harm, by going to Durham they avoided this potential risk as there was a support system in place there.

Cheers
Guy
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Offline arthurk

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #100 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:31 BST (UK) »
If that was his justification for going to Durham, it betrays a very cynical attitude towards those who didn't have the option of leaving London. Apparently the support services in London weren't good enough for the likes of him and his family, but everyone else had to just put up with them.

All in it together? That's a laugh.

(I note, Guy, that you haven't answered my question about DC going back to work, yet you have answered a more recent post.)

Offline Rishile

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #101 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:44 BST (UK) »

Sorry Ray but you are totally wrong as the guidance specifically includes -
"for any medical reason, to donate blood, avoid injury or illness, escape risk of harm, provide care or help a vulnerable person"

The reason for leaving London was covered by the above.

Guy - could you tell me which of the above is the reason DC went to Durham?  If it is 'for any medical reason' I would assume that meant either to visit a local doctor or hospital preferably in an ambulance.  Maybe I'm wrong on this point and most people would consider the best doctor/hospital is 260 miles away.   'Donating blood' has not been mentioned.  'Avoid injury or illness'?  I think the opposite was more likely to happen.  'Escape risk or harm'?  This is supposedly due to the mob outside his house.  Surely a phone call to the police would have been easier.  'Provide care'?  Again, not mentioned.  'Help a vulnerable person'?  Again not mentioned.

Please explain
Rishile

If you watch the daily press briefings you will have heard Dr Jenny Harries mention on a number of occasions the guidelines clearly state the exemption would be the "Escape risk or harm" if his wife was suffering from the virus and Dominic Cummings caught it he could become incapacitated very quickly leaving their son at risk of harm, by going to Durham they avoided this potential risk as there was a support system in place there.

Cheers
Guy

Surely this guidance was for anyone without the virus.  We were told that if we had even mild symptoms STAY AT HOME.  That was mentioned hundreds of times over the past few weeks and is still being mentioned now.  The government radio advert I am having forced down my throat at regular intervals clearly says that if you have any symptoms - even if they are mild - you and your family must STAY AT HOME.  Track and trace is telling people that if they come into contact with someone who later develops the virus they must STAY AT HOME.  What is that DC didn't understand?

Rishile
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Offline Gan Yam

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #102 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:45 BST (UK) »

Oh dear, oh dear, another don’t do as I do.....it seems Mr Ian Blackford MP chose to leave his tax payer funded home in London three days after lockdown.  He travelled 600 miles to Skye in order to isolate away from his wife Ann who has a lung condition.

His Tweet on the 26th - Returned to Skye from Westminster but into isolation as a precaution away from Ann and everyone else given the prevalence of the virus in London.

Article does not say where his wife was at this time, I sincerely hope he hadn’t left her in London whilst he fled the virus himself....Oh, but it’s ok because MPs had the right to return to their homes.  Three days after lock down ?? Tut tut Mr Blackford and there are you calling for DCs resignation or sacking...pots and kettles ?

Every MP  who does not have their main home in London has accommodation paid for by the tax payer, so he is not unique in that. He is probably one at least 500 or more in this position, with the exception of the Sein Fein MPs who do not take up their seat in Parliament.

 As far as I am aware MPs are not furloughed and have been free to attend parliament, social distanced of course, during this period when appropriate, and therefore free to travel to and from their place of work. Some  have.  Robert Jenrick, for example, choose to relocate his family to his 2nd or 3rd home while he continued to attend Downing Street and Parliament, travelling back and forth from that home as necessary.  There have been various MPs in Parliament over the period, Jacob Rhys-Mogg, for example, whose constituency is in Somerset and has attended parliament.

The only crime that he has committed seems to be that he stayed for 3 days before returning to his family home.  I suspect that he was not the only one who did not return home immediately, and may have had outstanding work to complete, and of course he could have travelled back and forth from Skye if he had felt it was necessary.  He, however, has appeared to remain on Skye for the whole period, attending parliament from his home via video link.

With regard to self isolating when he got home, I think that was the sensible thing to do.  He did not have or suspect he had the virus, but to safeguard the health of his wife (who I assume lives on Skye as his tweet seems to indicate), and in view of the amount of MPs who contracted the virus, it was reasonable to just in case.  I would hope that all MPs returning to their main home would have taken similar action in order to protect their families.

The difference between Ian Blackford was that he didn't think he had the virus and is free to travel to and from his place of work, just as Dominic Cummings has travelled to and from work before his trip to Durham and following his return.

If people are unhappy with Ian Blackford's actions or indeed any MP whatever their politics, the party can reprimand them if they think its necessary but ultimately it is the responsibility of their local constituency party to deselect them  or voters in their constituency not to vote for them.
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Offline Llwyd

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #103 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:48 BST (UK) »
How disappointing - the launch of Elon Musk's Space X was called off last night due to bad weather. My granddaughter had been allowed by her mother to stay up to watch it on tele last night and I didn't get to see it hurtling over Wales. Better luck on Saturday.
Uncle Drakeford will be making his announcement tomorrow about what freedom he is willing to let us have here in Wales. If it's what is being reported - probably deliberately leaked - it will not be the slightest use to me and my wife or our family and grandchildren living in England.
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Offline pharmaT

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #104 on: Thursday 28 May 20 19:49 BST (UK) »

Sorry Ray but you are totally wrong as the guidance specifically includes -
"for any medical reason, to donate blood, avoid injury or illness, escape risk of harm, provide care or help a vulnerable person"

The reason for leaving London was covered by the above.

Guy - could you tell me which of the above is the reason DC went to Durham?  If it is 'for any medical reason' I would assume that meant either to visit a local doctor or hospital preferably in an ambulance.  Maybe I'm wrong on this point and most people would consider the best doctor/hospital is 260 miles away.   'Donating blood' has not been mentioned.  'Avoid injury or illness'?  I think the opposite was more likely to happen.  'Escape risk or harm'?  This is supposedly due to the mob outside his house.  Surely a phone call to the police would have been easier.  'Provide care'?  Again, not mentioned.  'Help a vulnerable person'?  Again not mentioned.

Please explain
Rishile

If you watch the daily press briefings you will have heard Dr Jenny Harries mention on a number of occasions the guidelines clearly state the exemption would be the "Escape risk or harm" if his wife was suffering from the virus and Dominic Cummings caught it he could become incapacitated very quickly leaving their son at risk of harm, by going to Durham they avoided this potential risk as there was a support system in place there.

Cheers
Guy

He had options in London. In fact many more options than many other families had.  Either single parent families or where both parents were ill.  Also the lockdown guidance was that people could have travelled to give aid so his family in Durham travelling to pick up their son should the need arise would have been safer.  There are thousands of families out there that have tried to soldier on because they were told by the same Government that that was the correct thing to do.  Furthermore, on the subject of the 'spirit of the law' the clause allowing someone to travel to avoid harm was intended to allow victims  of domestic violence to escape to a place of safety.  DC would have known the intent of this clause and is twisting and exploiting it.  I will reiterate that in many occasions not breaking the law is insufficient to say that someone has done the right thing or acted honourably.  Is actions and even more so his defence is a slap in the face to everyone who struggled, suffered, and yet kept going and kept doing the right thing.

My colleague contracted Covid after being left in the position of refusing care or working without PPE, she could have travelled cross country to family but no, she set up  system where food (microwavable) was delivered contact free, a check in system to ensure help was sent should she worsen, and a list of people to come and get her child should she become completely incapable.  She did consider jumping in the car and driving while ill. They're saying she was irresponsible and did not love her child enough.

My daugher's Grt Uncle died in Co Durham (from Covid), his wife had to grieve alone with phone calls and food deliveries only as support.  They are saying we didn't love them enough to break lockdown because we 'did the right thing'.

It is my friend's husband's funeral next week.  Their daughter cannot be there due to the distance and none of us can go and support her.  They're saying we don't care enough.

I have had to make so many bad news phone calls, comfort people who cannot visit those they are worried about they are saying they don't care as they didn't break lockdown to see them.  I'm telling you very much did care,so many distraught people.  These people have been metaphorically slapped in the face.

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Offline IgorStrav

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #105 on: Thursday 28 May 20 20:00 BST (UK) »
Yes, Pharma.

And that is why it is even more distressing to be told to 'move on'.

There are many people who agree with you and more than 950 thousand have signed a petition to say so.

If other people hold other opinions that is their right.  However, minimising yours (and mine) by suggesting that 'it is all over' and we should move on, is not helpful.

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Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #106 on: Thursday 28 May 20 21:30 BST (UK) »
Cowban

Offline Kiltpin

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Re: General Discussion on Current Situation 2/
« Reply #107 on: Thursday 28 May 20 22:06 BST (UK) »
No one can really "move on" till they have dealt with unfinished business. The person who should be dealing with this unfinished business is the one urging us to move on. 

Regards 

Chas
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