Full age for Marriage in 1855

[Talacharn]

I am trying to establish a birth year.
Two census records say 1838 (1881, 1901). In 1911, it is 1835.
His Marriage Certificate in 1885 says his age was Full.
If Full was 21, it would mean a birth year of 1834 or before.

[avm228]

Yes, 21. Not everyone told the truth about their age at marriage.

[CaroleW]

Not only do you have to allow for people lying about their age when they married - you have to allow for birth year differences between their actual birthday and the time of the census (eg)

Born November 1872 - 1881 census taken March so age 8 is correct

However - subtract 8 from 1881 and you get a birth year of 1873

[Maiden Stone]

I am trying to establish a birth year.
Two census records say 1838 (1881, 1901). In 1911, it is 1835.
His Marriage Certificate in 1885 says his age was Full.
If Full was 21, it would mean a birth year of 1834 or before.

Did he marry in 1885 or 1855?
1885-21 = 1864
1855-21 = 1834
I'm better at sums than he was. 

[CaroleW]

Have you found him in 1841 & 1851?

Are you trying to find his parentage in parish records hence the birthyear?  Why not give us full details of whoever you are researching so we can have a look for you?

Please include his fathers name and occupation from his marriage cert. If any of the witnesses had the same surnames as him - please include that info as well

[Crumblie]

Are we talking England and Wales or Scotland? I ask because according to National Records of Scotland prior to 1929 a girl could marry at 12 and a boy at 14 without the need for parental consent.

[Talacharn]

Sorry for the lack of response, it was the last strand on my family tree in trying to go back another generation. After the first response, I concentrated on writing up the information I have. Also, I did not receive any notification of responses, which I need to address. I appreciate within formal documents the truth may not be recorded, false information was given, which has been the case throughout the generations. As the birth is before formal records, I now do not feel the answer will be found. Thank you for your responses.

He was Welsh. His name being Thomas Williams and according to the marriage certificate (1855) his father was John a labourer. Without pin-pointing a year, it is impossible to find a Thomas Williams in West Wales as the dates say between 1834 and 1838. Two census records say the later. I asked because his age being noted as full. If that was 21, it would suggest a birth year of 1834 or before. The other issue is that he was born in Newcastle Emlyn, which borders different counties that changed it boundaries over time. One census says Newcastle in Emlyn, Cardigan. Born in Newcastle Emlyn seems consistent.

I looked at his wife Margaret Howell and the census dates are just as vague and there are more of census records. But I have a christening that notes her date of birth as 19 Jun 1834. He was a mariner/labourer depending on the census and at the time there was plenty of freight by sea, so I assume he was away for certain census dates. I have him in 1901 living in Llanelli (b. 1838) and working as a Navvy having separated from his wife. By 1911 he was in the Union Workhouse in Llanelli (b. 1835).

For Laugharne the 1861 census is missing, which could have answered so much. I can find her still with family in 1851, but not Thomas Williams, though he could be working/living anywhere. And nothing for him in 1841. He may be recorded on both, I simply do not know where.

Added: Witnesses of the marriage were her father Jonah Howell and Jane Killa, who I believe ran a public house; both locals to Laugharne.

[Maiden Stone]

Full age was 21 or over. It meant he didn't need parental permission to marry.
Ancestors of mine married 30th April 1843. Both "full age". I know that the bride was exactly 21. Her birthday was April. The groom was recorded as being aged 20 on 1841 census which means he was 20-24. He may have just turned 20 or he might have been 25 later that year.  Therefore I estimate year of birth 1816-1821. Age was 33 on 1851 census, which gives him an estimated year of birth c.1818. He was in the household of a workmate on the night of 1851 census so his recorded age may not have been accurate. Taking all that into account, he was aged between 21-26 when he married in April 1843. He was literate & numerate so probably knew his age.
 

[Talacharn]

Both Thomas Williams and Margaret Howell signed the marriage certificate with an X. So did witnesses Jonah Howell and Jane Killa. I can understand how people gave inaccurate dates or ages. To know their age, they would rely on parents, who may not know with any certainty. They had so many children and many died in their early years, when names were re-used adding to the confusion, certainly in my family.