Martin Timmons/Timons

[Chris1286]

Hi has anyone have information on the following person. He is a grandfather of a friend of mine. He is called the above name and was born so she thinks in Ireland. He married her grandmother Rose Ellen Parry on the 17.11.1902 at Machen, South Wales.
They had a child called Margaret Ann Timons, born 13.4.1907 Cwmcan.
Martin died in 1909 aged 38 years. I can find nothing about him on Ancestry?
Thanks. Chris Reeves

[avm228]

It’s unfortunate if the timing means he doesn’t appear in a UK census, first appearing in Wales in 1902 and dying before 1911.  Has your friend obtained his marriage certificate, for paternal details?

[avm228]

Children:

Annie Timmons, mmn Parry, Sep qtr 1903 Newport
Kathleen Timmons, mmn Parry, Sep qtr 1905 Newport
Margaret Ann Timmons, mmn Parry, Jun qtr 1907 Newport
William Leonard Timmons, mmn Parry, Mar qtr 1911 Newport

[Chris1286]

Yes it gives his father name also as martin Timmons or Timons?
Chris

[aghadowey]

It’s unfortunate if the timing means he doesn’t appear in a UK census, first appearing in Wales in 1902 and dying before 1911.  Has your friend obtained his marriage certificate, for paternal details?

 

If he was in Ireland in 1901 he will appear in a 'U.K. census.' However, there are several possibilities in Ireland so you'll need more details to confirm a match.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

Typed before father's name was posted

[avm228]

Sorry - should have been clearer that I meant it would have been helpful to find him locally in Wales in 1901, near the marriage place for confidence that he was the right one!  Nothing against Irish census obviously 

[aghadowey]

His birth registration should, in theory, also be online (registration of births started 1864) but I can't yet see a Martin T*m*ns with father Martin around that period. This is an illegitimate one with mother Mary (no father listed) so there's always the possibility he made up a father's name when he married or the birth was registered without a Christian name or under another surname.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-search.jsp

[Annette7]

Wonder if the following could possibly be him although it's all a bit confusing.

A Martin Timmins birth is reg'd Mar.1871 Manchester, mmn Moran

A Martin Timmins marriage Dec.1868 Manchester to an Ellen Kelly

1871 Census - Manchester

Martin Timmins   32    born Ireland
Ellen Timmins 23              ditto
Thomas Timmins 1      born Manchester

At this point there is no trace of the Martin Timmins born Mar.1871 nor is there a death entry - also, there is no birth registered for the Thomas Timmins bc.1870 Manchester.   Could Thomas and Martin junior be one and the same?

Martin and Ellen still in Manchester 1881 and 1891 - son 'Thomas' with them 1881 but no trace of him in this name after then, plus 2 daughters Mary E. bc.1874 and Eliza bc.1879 had been born BUT their mmn shown as Daley.

All confusing as I say in that Martin married an Ellen Kelly, no birth entry for a son Thomas bc.1870 Manchester (was he actually Martin birth Mar.l1871 but mmn shown as Moran,  and then 2 daughters born whose mmn this time given as Daley.    All Irish surnames but 3 different ones!!

Martin Timmins and wife Ellen were the only couple of this name in Manchester.   He appears to have died 1894 Prestwich, Lancashire so that would tie in with Martin younger stating his father was dead when he married in 1902.   Was he called Thomas by the family in 1871 and 1881 as it was confusing have 2 Martins in the household but he married (and subsequently died) under his real name of Martin?   Who knows.

Anyway, thought it worth mentioning this for consideration.

Annette 

 

[Chris1286]

Thanks for the info. I will get back to my Friend. She might have some further info?
Chris