Joseph Septimus Carr - who is he?

[cafetiere]

Ah, sorry. Should have known you'd have spotted that already.

Took a trip (literally, as I fell over in the graveyard!) to Newchurch and Waterfoot this weekend but didn't spot any Irvine graves. Difficult to look around though - overgrown (and slippy!)

[mckha489]

There is a lot of information in that thread. Easy to miss.

It seems to be the rule that graveyards have a slippery patch you slip over in. Either that or the very grave you went to see is covered in blackberry and you didn’t have your gardening gloves and secateurs  in the boot.
(Secateurs autocorrected to sedatives, perhaps more useful!)

[Maiden Stone]

Did you get your feet wet in Waterfoot? 
Death of Joseph Septimus Carr , senior, object of your original search,  in 1871 was reported to the coroner. It's listed in coroners' expense accounts in Lancashire Archives. If it was an accidental death it may have been reported in a local newspaper. I was puzzled because the district was Spotland on the coroner's record, whereas the death was registered in Whitworth & Brandwood sub-district on Lancashire BMD index. Turns out Spotland included Whitworth and Brandwood townships. Brandwood township was the other side of the River Irwell from Waterfoot.
His occupation on marriage register of one of his daughters has been transcribed on LANOPC as 'Grainer and sun writer'.    I meant to submit a correction.

[mckha489]

I saw that.  Grainer as in a person who can paint surfaces to look like something else. Eg walnut paint effect on top of an old bit of pine.  Even marble effects. There are whole kits of grainers tools you can buy. It’s a hobby of my husband.  At one point we had a “marble” tile  floor with “oak” strips between the “tiles” while we saved up for carpet.

[cafetiere]

Did you get your feet wet in Waterfoot? 
Death of Joseph Septimus Carr , senior, object of your original search,  in 1871 was reported to the coroner. It's listed in coroners' expense accounts in Lancashire Archives. If it was an accidental death it may have been reported in a local newspaper. I was puzzled because the district was Spotland on the coroner's record, whereas the death was registered in Whitworth & Brandwood sub-district on Lancashire BMD index. Turns out Spotland included Whitworth and Brandwood townships. Brandwood township was the other side of the River Irwell from Waterfoot.
His occupation on marriage register of one of his daughters has been transcribed on LANOPC as 'Grainer and sun writer'.    I meant to submit a correction.

Maybe he tripped over in a Newchurch graveyard as well? 

Interesting about grainer as well - I'd have read that and maybe assumed grain merchant? I presume 'sun writer' is sign writer?

This is all great stuff again, thanks so much both of you.

[wonoona]

I see you have found part of my family tree which is a maze.  Re: Thomas Irvine/Carr he used both
names.  His father my 2nd gt grandfather Joseph Septimus Irvine was married twice.  Thomas is one of 4 children to Ann Rowstron his first wife, they had Thomas, Mary Ellen, Elizabeth Ann and Clara. Thomas is married to
Catherine Maria or Kate maybe nee Lambert! she died in July 1896 in West Derby.  Joseph Septimus Irvine was born in Lancaster to Thomas Irvine and Mary Tebay but Mary married twice and her
second husband was John Carr and this is why Carr is in all their names as the children took this
name.  Joseph Septimus Irvine died 29.11.1871 aged 55. An accident on slippy street I think a
broken leg and complications.  He was brought back from Bacup to be buried in Blackpool.  Anyway hope these few details help a little, do get in touch if I can help anymore. 

[cafetiere]

I see you have found part of my family tree which is a maze.  Re: Thomas Irvine/Carr he used both
names.  His father my 2nd gt grandfather Joseph Septimus Irvine was married twice.  Thomas is one of 4 children to Ann Rowstron his first wife, they had Thomas, Mary Ellen, Elizabeth Ann and Clara. Thomas is married to
Catherine Maria or Kate maybe nee Lambert! she died in July 1896 in West Derby.  Joseph Septimus Irvine was born in Lancaster to Thomas Irvine and Mary Tebay but Mary married twice and her
second husband was John Carr and this is why Carr is in all their names as the children took this
name.  Joseph Septimus Irvine died 29.11.1871 aged 55. An accident on slippy street I think a
broken leg and complications.  He was brought back from Bacup to be buried in Blackpool.  Anyway hope these few details help a little, do get in touch if I can help anymore.

Hi, that's great. Yes, we must be related

Do you know why they changed their name? This thread has been fascinating for me and I've had great help with untangling this. I can only guess that as Kate/Catherine Lambert was married before she was still married at it was rather scandalous? I can't find much on her 1st husband to know when he died - I'm guessing he didn't until just before Kate 2nd marriage.

[Maiden Stone]

Joseph Septimus Irvine died 29.11.1871 aged 55. An accident on slippy street I think a
broken leg and complications.  He was brought back from Bacup to be buried in Blackpool. 

So cafetiere's guess about Joseph's accident was almost correct.

[cafetiere]

Joseph Septimus Irvine died 29.11.1871 aged 55. An accident on slippy street I think a
broken leg and complications.  He was brought back from Bacup to be buried in Blackpool. 

So cafetiere's guess about Joseph's accident was almost correct.

Yes!