SEWELL/can anyone help

[audrey]

can anyone help me with this

1841 census  Botchergate Carlisle

John Sewell age 55 Cotton weaver
Mary age 55
William age 30 b 7/6/1809 carlisle
Sarah age 25 b 1/10/1815  "     "
Mary age 25 b 15/9/1816   "    " 
John age 13 b Preston Lancs cant find this

as you can see big age gap between children Mary and John  and all kids born Carlisle apart from John can find no death for the mother Mary[ formally Robinson] and I cant find a second marriage for John  cant move further with this  as I cant prove that John who is my  G.Grandfather  was the child of John Sewell and Mary Robinson any suggestions all the names I am doing are proving very difficult

audrey

[sillgen]

Have you looked at Preston parish records to try to find a baptism for John?   What about deaths for children between Mary and John?   (His mother would only have been 42 when she had him - not late in those days!) Carlisle parish records will have those - presumably the same church as the others were baptised in or they may be Preston too.   It seems odd that they were in Preston just for his birth but it is not very far away. 
Good luck with the search.  He will be there somewhere!
Andrea

[audrey]

Andrea
thanks for the reply I have found another Child for Mary and John, Margaret Sewell b Carlisle 1807 I checked all the children out at Carlisle records office all born Carlisle and Chris.same church however there was nothing for John
thanks
audrey

[Valda]

Have you found John and Mary on the 1851 census to get a better idea of their actual ages, since the 1841 census is rounding up or down the age for adults and not giving an exact age (so both could be nearer 60 than 55). There is no reason from the information on the 1841 census where relationships are not given to presume that John is a son of John and Mary. Could he be a grandson of an older child of John and Mary? Have you checked Carlisle and Preston for a John Sewell born to other Sewell parents or parent?

Regards
Valda

[audrey]

Valda
I did request a lookup of the 1851 Census for Carlisle a while back but got no reply

audrey

[Valda]

As the 1841 census doesn't give places of birth you are making an assumption that the 1841 census is the correct John (the 1861 census, the earliest I have access to, gives another John Sewell born in Carlisle at about the same time),  though I appreciate both Johns are in Botchergate in 1841 and 1861 and the other John wasn't in 1861, you need to fill in the gaps from the 1851 census.

This website gives a list of names and ages on each fiche of the 1851 census index covered by the Cumbria Family History Society.

http://rolyg.members.beeb.net/CensusNames.htm

What does your John Sewell's marriage say about his father and his occupation?

Regards
Valda

[sillgen]

I am confused now!    Valda is right and I should have realised that 1841 does not give places of birth.  Where did you get the places from that you quoted??
Andrea

[audrey]

thanks for the reply I am sorry but I am not very good at explaining things so I will try again
I went to Carlisle records office two years ago with the help of the lady there we found the on the 1841 census Botchergate[ East Street ]
John Sewell age 55
Mary Sewell age 55
William age 30
Sarah age 25
Mary age 25
John age 13

she then looked at her files and found
a Marriage for John and Mary Robinson 1807
we then looked for the  children found all the the above Chris in Carlisle  apart from John  as we couldn't find that we then tried looking for a marriage cert for John  to Mary Douglas abt 1851-52 but nothing I was adviced to try Dumfries where Mary Douglas was born  so last year I went to Dumfries but no Marriage there, I have death certs.for both John  age 13 above and  his wife Mary and I have berth certs for the oldest son James Sewell born 1853 and the youngest Robert Sewell b 1871 Robert is my grandfather I have John Sewell age 13 above  and Mary Douglas on all census from 1861 then living Fodens court  some give his place of berth as Preston Lancs, some Carlisle I can cross check Addresses on census with that on certs .I have and it all checks out apart from ages from 1841 all the Sewells were in the Cotton trade and I hope all the above make some sense I am sorry for any confusion because I appear to have several John and Marys in every generation

audrey

[sue smith]

Hi Audrey

Carlisle 1851 is paperbased and in 7 parts - more if you count the outlying districts that form part of the city today.

There is an on-line name index at http://rolyg.members.beeb.net/CensusNames.htm and you can buy the full transcript booklets from http://www.cumbriafhs.com/ -  prices are not too bad.

Botchergate was (from memory) in parts 3 & 6.  3 is one the on-line name index and I have a copy of the full transcript for part 6.  This lists at 3 Baty's Court:

John Sewell H M 28 Shoe Maker CUL Carlisle
Jane Sewell W M 26 CUL Carlisle

whom I think is the wrong John(?).  No sign of John & Mary senior in the part I have but possibles for them in part 3 so may be worth getting hold of a copy to check it out.

However there were a lot of cotton mills in Carlisle at the time (see http://www.stevebulman.f9.co.uk/cumbria/industry.html ) and the family may have moved around the city so probably worth checking out all the possibles on the name index.  Maybe a trip to or contact with the record office would be cheaper!

Sue