Jenkin Williams Llandefalle wealthy family (Skreen, Velyn Newydd) 1760 to 1800s

[Redkite23]

Hi Llanfihangel.

I can only trace The North Wales Williams in my family tree to 1731 with William ap William. Further back it is all patronymics which I am struggling with.

Redkite23

[Redkite23]

Hi Llanfihangel.

I have been through the information you put on line and have the following comments.
1)  I did not know Thomas Williams (soldier died 1803) had a surviving son.
2) Same mistake as Theophilius Jones with Jenkin Williams married Elizabeth Beavan. It was Mary. For the record the evidence is at The NLW as a Radnorshire marriage bond, Newchurch, feb 9th 1782. I find that mistakes  become perpetuated especially in online family trees.
3) William Bois (or William ap Jenkins) had two sons William Williams of Velin newydd and his younger brother John Williams of Skreen. William Williams had two surviving children Jenkin and Gwillian. The article you placed online states that this Gwenillian married her cousin John Williams but John Williams was her Uncle not cousin. Jenkin Williams left a will in 1754 leaving substantial bequests to HIS nieces Ann and Fortune. They could only be HIS nieces if they were his sisters children. So it seems the extract is correct and John Williams married his niece. Was this legal? or was there some cross breeding in the family to make sure property remained within the family- which certainly happened with the English Gentry.
Like the situation with Willbrooke I am as interested in how my ancestors lived as much as the strict genealogy. With most of my ancestors there is not enough information available as there is in the case of the Williams.

Redkite23

[hanes teulu]

Something of a mystery! I completed a post Friday but it seems to have disappeared into the ether.

The gist of the post was about the Thomas Williams, 1737 "... gent steward of the said mannor", the said manor being " ... Mannor of Willbrook alias Wirkbrook.". A Thomas Williams, steward, is mentioned 1734-1737.

Wondered what link, if any, there might be to the Thomas Williams that purchased Willbrook manor house"? The source of the info was "The History of Ewyas Lacy - Manorial Court records for the manors of Clothy Hopkin, Urishay, Trenant and Wellbrook"

 

[Redkite23]

Hi Hanes Teulu

You may be right but it needs investigating. I had initially written this line off as not connected with the Skreen and Llandefalle Williams . However, Jones book in 1809 states the first Thomas Williams (owner of both Felin Newydd and Skreen) died in 1779 aged 61 giving a birth year of 1718. His son also Thomas Williams was born in 1755 while his brother Jenkin Williams was born in 1757. There seems a long gap between 1718 and 1755. Enough time for another Thomas Williams perhaps. I do not think this is likely but there is enough to suggest it should be looked into.
N.B. Where did you get a copy of The History of Ewyas Lacy from ? It is part of the Ancient lands of Archenfield and given a Charter by King John to fight 160 days against the Welsh and 160 days against the English. Apparently the Charter has never been withdrawn. I always wished I was born there but alas I was not.

Redkite23

[hanes teulu]

https://www.ewyaslacy.org.uk

I searched for "willbrook" and alternatives

 

[Llanfihangel]

Hello Redkite,

You will be fascinated by
"The King's Daughter" digitised at the Library of Wales!

https://journals.library.wales/view/1164385/1165128/64#?xywh=-1949%2C-206%2C6395%2C3894

Cheers,

Llanfi 

[Redkite23]

Hi Hanes Teulu

The Ewyas Lacy site has a lot of info but the Thomas Williams was Steward of Wilbrook in 1737. That would  mean his birth was much earlier. If there is a connection between the Willbrook and Llandevalle Williams it would have been Thomas Williams born circa 1718 son of John Williams. A connection is still possible but looks unlikely.

Redkite23

[hanes teulu]

Hi Hanes Teulu

The Ewyas Lacy site has a lot of info but the Thomas Williams was Steward of Wilbrook in 1737. That would  mean his birth was much earlier. If there is a connection between the Willbrook and Llandevalle Williams it would have been Thomas Williams born circa 1718 son of John Williams. A connection is still possible but looks unlikely.

Redkite23

Thanks for the response. That it was 1737 is why I queried a possibel link!
Chasing Thomas Williamses in that neck of the woods is a nightmare - in fact, chasing that name anywhere presents problems.

Re. "The King's Daughter" and Anne Williams I had been reading a great deal on Welsh Journals about Howell Harris and his wooing of Anne - for example the Trefecca letters. Stiil , true love won through in spite of all the obstacles. 

regards

[Redkite23]

Hanes Teulu

Hello
I looked further into your idea of Thomas Williams 1737 Steward of Willbrooke. There was also a Jenkin Williams who served on the Leet Court Jury of 1737-1739 for Willbrooke Manor and and his wife actually appeared at the Leet Court in 1744. Jenkin Williams had 2 daughters in Peterchurch -Ann in 1725 and Mary in 1728. Mother was Cecelia in the first one and Sissy in the second-looks like the same mother.  I cannot decide if this family line of Williams is relevant but I am tending toward the view that it is not.

Redkite23