Missing Smiths in Stockport 1851 census

[kctoo]

Hi Chatters,

After much searching I seem unable to find some important records for my Smiths in Stockport, so I thought I might see if anyone here might know a reason they might be missing or have an idea how I might go about finding them.

Here are my Smiths on the 1841. They appear as the 10th group enumerated along the New Bridge Lane at St Mary's

William Smith 35 Crofter
Hannah Smith 35
Richard Smith 15  (this my gg grandfather, he emmigrated to Australia after this census*)
Hannah Smith 7

My Richard's marriage entry in Castlemaine Victoria in 1857 records his birthplace as Stockport Cheshire, his age as 28, occupation farmer,  his father as William Smith, farmer and mother as Anna Swindell

Coincidentally there is another near identical household in George st Stockport on the same census but the occupation is different

William Smith 35 Bleacher
Hannah Smith 35
Richard Smith 15
Hannah Smith 5

Despite William's occupation not being a match, for a time I thought these possibly mine as you will see next

 The 1861 @ 26 George St has

William Smith 57 Carter b. Bolton
Hannah Smith 57 b. New Mills Derbyshire
Anna Smith     18 b.Stockport
William Smith   4 GSon b.Stockport

these are mine as the GRO has Anna's mother's maiden name recorded as Swindell

Hannah next appears on the 1871 at 90 Travis St Heaton Norris a Widow living with daughter Anna who has subsequently married husband Lot Mellor and their children.

The 1881 sees her still with the Mellors but this time at 46 High Bury St Heaton Norris

Hannah's death entry in 1883 records her abode as 5 Heawoods Court with Ann present at death.

But with all this I cannot find William and Hannah on the '51.  Or Richard's birth circa 1825 or William's death for that matter. I know the census' at least narrow the window down to sometime between the 1861 and 1871.  But none of the ages of the Williams on the GRO who died inbetween the census dates match up.  If there is anyone out there with local knowledge who can point me in the right direction to look I would be most grateful to them.

Many thanks for any assistance
Kerry in
Sunny Brisbane
Australia

* one of 2 dozen Richard Smiths of approx the right age to emmigrate from England to Victoria between 1841 and his marriage in 1857.  Not all shipping lists record an occupation and none of these Richards' lists record even the county the passengers are from.  My most likely suspect arrived in Dec 1852 on the Covenanter at Port Phillip.  One of only two confirmed farmers and this one left from Liverpool rather than the one on the Evening Star which embarked from London and was also less of a match age wise.

[rosie99]

For information 1841 references
 
William the Crofter
HO107/114 bk4 f5 p2
Only Richard and young Hannah are born in Cheshire

William the Bleacher -
HO107/114 bk3  f44 p15 
This family are all born in the County of Cheshire

My Richard's marriage entry in Castlemaine Victoria in 1857 records his birthplace as Stockport Cheshire, his age as 28, occupation farmer,  his father as William Smith, farmer and mother as Anna Swindell

[DCB]

May not help, but these are the only records I can find. Assuming the same family, the last child was born in the same year as the 1851 census

Hannah Swindels and William Smith married on 20 Jun 1825 at Northenden, Cheshire

SARAH SMITH - Baptism date 6 Apr 1828 STOCKPORT St. Mary dau of William, a bleacher of New Bridge Lane, and Hannah

ANN SMITH - Baptism date 18 Sep 1842 CHEADLE dau of William, a bleacher of Edgeley, and Hannah

SMITH, ANN mmn SWINDELLS 1839 J Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 19 Page 219

SMITH, ANN mmn SWINDELLS 1842 S Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 19 Page 271

SMITH, ELIZA mmn SWINDELLS 1851 S Quarter in STOCKPORT Volume 19 Page 321

David

[kctoo]

Thanks Rosie 99 for clarifing the 41 entries.  I was finding it difficult deciphering the handwriting on the copies I had.   

And David thanks too.

But now I am really confused because it seems William the Bleacher in George st on the 41 was at New Bridge Lane in 1828.

And William the Crofter of New Bridge lane on the 41, I think, is William the Carter at 26 George St on the 61.  And no one is on the '51!!!

Except for both George's appearing on the 41 census I would be starting to think that George St and New Bridge Lane are the same address and there is actually only one George with two jobs!! 

Unfortunately I am not sure about that last Eliza Swindell you mention as in 1850 a Noah Smith married Mary Swindells at Stockport so any other Smith/Swindell offspring are now under a further cloud.

I have a copy of the registers recording William and Hannah's marriage by Banns at Northenden. And have gone so far as to scroll thru their Baptism registers for any offspring( ie my Richard) but no luck.

In the absence of being able to find a record of my Richard's birth or Baptism I am now contemplating ordering his sister Ann's entry from the GRO in case there are any clues.

Once again thank you both
very much appreciated
Kerry

[kctoo]

Update

Just had a look at 1874 OS map to find that George St is now known as Mary St and at that time ran close and parallel to New Bridge Lanes.  Could the enumerater have stayed too long at the Stanley Arms where he started his quest?  Or maybe I just have to face the facts that I have Smiths and these kind of odd coincidences are just going to crop up.  It's getting late here on this side of the planet so I best be off and work some more on this tomorrow. 

thanks again to all for the new info
Kerry

[rosie99]

The enumerator would have had forms completed by both of the occupiers before they were entered on the schedule

[kctoo]

This is great info Rosie. I did not know this. 

I'm not taking my twice recorded theory too seriously but I would like to rule it out if I easily can.

Just looking again at both occupiers, the H's on the Hannah's look different to me.

Is there a way to tell if the two books were taken by the same enumerator?

So very grateful for you sharing your knowledge on this,
Kerry

[rosie99]

Looking at both images the capital letters on all the names of these families do not look as though they were written by the same person.

Sometimes at the beginning of each part of some census there are pages which include walking route that 'may' include the enumerators name

[DCB]

Found the baptism:-

Richard Smith, born 10th August 1825, baptised 13th July 1834 in Edgeley, son of William, bleacher, and Hannah.

William, no birth date, also on same day.

Hannah, no birth date, also on same day.

David

P.S.

Also in Cheadle, Esther daughter of William and Nancy baptised on 1st May 1842. William a crofter, like the second in 1841.

And on 2nd June 1832, Samuel son of William and Nancy, this time a bleacher.

Also Thomas on 17th January 1836, on this occasion a crofter.

PP.S

A crofter and bleacher are similar occupations - http://www.wrmitchellarchive.org.uk/sites/default/files/pdfs/learning/cotton_jobs.pdf