Finally admitted defeat!

[jacky_d]

Hi all iv posted several things on the site and in all honesty the response has been amazing. I am far from a beginner, however iv hit the same brick wall now since i started back in 201/2002! and just do not know where else to continue with my search.
My italian great grandparents were married in cardiff in 1883 but my great grandfather appears to have disappeared until 1889/90 and during this time my great grandmother gave birth to 2 children one in 1885 the other in 1888. I have had my DNA done and all my italian matches are leading back to Senerchia Italy. but I can not find my great grandfather leaving the uk or entering the UK and I just do not know where else to search iv done all the criminal records all the aliases which i know they used and i also have all the uk documents to back the things up that I already know. so if any one can give me guidance on where I should go from here I would really appreciate it please.
I have had a suggestion from some one that he may have had to have gone back to Italy perhaps around 1885 due to the Eritrean War but im not sure how or where to find any information.
Thank you in advance

[josey]

Can you post links to your previous threads? Saves duplication of effort.

[Daonnachd]

This might sound random, but any chance he could have worked on ships, boats, trains, etc?

Steamboats travelled right around the UK, stopping to pick up and put down at various ports along the way, but sometimes without ever leaving the UK - e.g., Edinburgh to Exmouth and back round again via ports such as Liverpool etc. etc.. I found this out when searching for a 'disappeared' 3x GGrandfather. I imagine it would be similar for freight on trains.

This would mean he would not appear on passenger or crew lists for foreign travel.
 
If this is the case, he could seem to disappear, but be away for a while and come back for visits!

Though if he isn't mentioned on the birth certificates, then perhaps not?

[jacky_d]

Hi Josey there are no previous threads to this query all other queries were related to my great grandparents children and through the help of this site have now been resolved. But thank you for your response.
LindseyC  thank you and i actually thought about this too but I have now found the father of the first 2 children and he was Italian too, Its so difficult as I have so many DNA matches but I can not make a connection until firstley I find out where he was and secondly his birth records, I have always thought he was married to someone else as well as my great grandmother,  but all my lines of enquiry just keep hitting a constant brick wall. 

[jim1]

There isn't going to be much in the way of information between the 1881-91 census.
You say that 2 children born 1885 & 88 have a different father but do they have his surname or the husband's?
Could it be the husband using a different name or have you ruled that out?

[jacky_d]

Hi Jim1 the boys took on the family name/s until 1904 then both reverted to a name which is untraceable but Iv now do know who the father is and he was also a married man and we have made contact with that side of the family. there are endless trees which my Grandfather would slot into nicely but its not enough and I really  don't want to contact all of my DNA matches with Maybe's or ifs. I just don't know if because iv been doing it for so long and trying so hard im blocked as to where to go next!  Thank you for your reply.

[jim1]

the boys took on the family name/s until 1904 then both reverted to a name which is untraceable

Doesn't really answer the question.
So is the family name that of the father or the husband & did they revert to the father's name later or the husband's?

[familydar]

Hi again Jacky

How genetically close/distant are your Italian DNA matches?  They may not be descended from your missing man, they may be descended from his parents or grandparents.  Do you have parents for him?  Was his father Nicola?

Also, on what do you base your Italian GGF's disappearance?    I count myself lucky if I can find mine on all censuses and present at their own marriages but for all I know they may have been elsewhere in the country (or abroad!) for the intervening periods.  I've not inherited any diaries saying where someone was and with whom for a year, let alone several years.  Voters lists and rate books are a bonus but until universal franchise I'd only ever expect to see head of house.  Children's school records may name the father but it could be the mother who gave this info, dad could have been away with his fancy woman but mum would hardly advertise this fact!  We assume that if the father is named on a bap then he was present for that bap (and the conception) but unless we have a photo or he actually signed the register (and that's not normal for CofE but Catholic ones may be different) we have no hard evidence.  When the children marry they may not know their father's proper name, they may invent someone to avoid embarrassment for whatever reason, the father named may be their stepfather, etc etc.

Rootschat has a Travelling People board which might give you some leads on where to look for Antonio if his trade was a fairground organ player.

[iluleah]

I can not find my great grandfather leaving the uk or entering the UK

You won't unless he was a passenger on a ship so if he traveled by land there is no record http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/passengers/