Scotland Ward, Liverpool

[RobbieJax]

I have an ancestor, Mary Jones, born circa 1830. In censuses 1851 through 1881, she is living in Liverpool and her 'Where Born' is Scotland. Obviously, Jones was not such a common name in Scotland. Maybe it's just that the archiving of parish baptisms from around 1830 is not so good in Scotland but I can not find her birth there.

All of her time in Liverpool, she lived off Scotland Road in Scotland ward. Is it possible that on the censuses, Scotland really meant Scotland ward, Liverpool. In the 1861 census, 2 of her children are born in Liverpool and one is born in Scotland. In GRO, all 3 of her children were born in Liverpool. Strange that the census would list one child differently.

I know that there was a Liverpool Scotland constituency. Just wondering if the district was known as Scotland and that was what was intended in the censuses. Clutching at straws (obviously). Thanks

[ShaunJ]

The only ones I can see at first pass are married women. Or is Jones her maiden name?

[RobbieJax]

Sorry, yes, Jones is her maiden name. Her married name is Metcalfe (often spelt wrong in the censuses). For example in the 1861 census, Mary Melcalfe and son Thomas show as born in Scotland

[andrewalston]

"Scotland" is still understood in Liverpool to mean the area around Scotland Road - or "Scotty Road".

I  have seen it used in censuses to mean this, in the same way that a Londoner might write "Paddington" without any reference to a county.

[ShaunJ]

I don't buy this at all. If the census recorded the birthplace as Scotland, Lancashire then I might be persuaded (though I've never seen it) but if it's just "Scotland" then that means Scotland the country.

[libby9]

I don't buy this at all. If the census recorded the birthplace as Scotland, Lancashire then I might be persuaded (though I've never seen it) but if it's just "Scotland" then that means Scotland the country.

I agree, and all the censuses say Scotland, apart from 1861 which has her born Liverpool, it's odd though that Thomas' birth was registered in Liverpool but the 1861 census gives birth place Scotland, I wonder if the enumerator confused the two and transposed birth places for Mother and son.

[RobbieJax]

Thanks, all, for your opinions. It is possible that the census-taker made a mistake as he also transposed Robert and Thomas. Robert was the 3yo and Thomas was 1yo.

Is it possible that she told the census-taker that she was born in Scotland and he just assumed the country and transcribed it as such. I have searched through a lot of pages of censuses looking for anything that was transcribed as Scotland, Lancashire and hadn't found any. I assume that they didn't transcribe it as such. I was thinking more a simple error of interpretation like I suggest.

[Rosinish]

This is a strange one as normally the County (then area) a person was born would be recorded rather than an area on it's own.

Were the family literate as being asked where they were born they may have assumed the area (in Liverpool) named Scotland was what was being asked & depending on the Enumerators' knowledge may not have given it a 2nd thought if unaware of the area being called Scotland?

Was Scotland in Liverpool an actual area (at the time) or just an area locals referred to which later became officially know as Scotland?

Do you have a name & occ. for her father to look for her on the 1841 which would at least/hopefully give her mother's name to look for her baptism or their marriage?

Annie

[RobbieJax]

No, she was definitely not literate at the time. I have the birth certificate of her daughter in 1864 and she signed with her mark.

From the 1850 marriage certificate, the father was Thomas Jones, a farmer. They (assuming she was living with her family at the time) were living at 62, Victoria St, Everton. None of the family were living at that address a year later. I have searched for her in the 1841 census and in parish baptisms. Too many Mary Jones in Liverpool. No matches in Scotland

Liverpool Scotland was recognized as a constituency in 1885 but it was definitely a Municipal Ward in 1861. Not sure about 1851 census as FindMyPast is down right now so I can't check