Location of Torcoon, Canonbie

[Jeffrey]

Hi Monica,

Yes have got the 1841 Census for Charters and her Grandmother Margaret Halliday thanks. However can not find her mother Agnes Bell in 1841. But looking on the 1861 census at the birth place of ANTHONY HANAH who she married he was born in Wigtonshire - wonder if they are over there. I have the transcriptions of the Parishes of Canonbie, Hutton & Corrie & Ewes but there is no Hanah.

I do not know where Charters Jackson got to in the 1851 Census. Sometimes the name is transcribed as Charteris, Chartres, Charteres, Chate or Charles

Looking at who young Agnes's father could have been. She married a William Armstrong from Bewcastle, Cumberland at Gretna Green, so did not get the parents names from there. However Anthony Hanah her step granparent was a witness. William A had been married before so had named his first children after his father and grandfather and his female child after his mother. So Agnes could have named her first male child Robert after her father, she named her first female child after her mother.

Incidently the person that William Armstrong was married to before Agnes was a Charters & on her death certificate she was the right age to have been Agnes's mother!!!! Can not find a marriage cert for them though.

I have tried freecen since you mentioned it but can not get it even to come up with Charters or her grandmother Margaret Halliday in 1841 - how did you get that?

I find SP site quite expensive and quite restricting as to how you can search. However when I had a problem with reading the transcript they were very good.

Many thanks again for all your help and input.

Judy

[MonicaL]

Judy

I can see an Anthony Hannah in both freecen 1841 and 1851 Dumgal census (the only one showing) living in Whithorn. The 1851 index gives his birthplace as Whithorn, WGT. Is this the right one? Interestingly, an Agnes shows in the 1841 index but not in the 1851.  The address from the 1851 census is Cattyens (900) household no. 2/5A. His sisters seem to have lived with him over this period.

Strange how they seem to have aged 20-25 years between the censuses!

Monica

Added: I've just checked the 1861 census on SP. We now have TWO Anthony Hannah showing! One still in Whithorn (as above) and the other as you found in Cannonbie. So the 1841/51 is not ours. Back to the drawing board....!!!

[MonicaL]

Ok, found Charters in 1851! Your comment about Charters being often mis-indexed as Charles made me think and sure enough I found a female Charles Jackson in Castleton, Roxburgh. She's a farm servant and birthplace shows as Hutton, Dum. I'll PM you with more details.

To find Charter in freecen should be straighforward as she's indexed correctly (stating the obvious or not so sometimes!) have you ticked 1841 at the top left? The default is 1891.

So Charters is not with mother in 1851. I've done a search for Anthony Han* in the whole of Scotland, there are only 7 entries. Four are children, one is 75 in Argyll, 35 in Barony Glasgow and then our man in Whithorn. Have you checked the English census for them?

Just out of interest, who did Charters marry? Charters is such an unusual first name, it seems uncanny that young Agnes married a man whose first wife also had that name......specially if the birth ages fit..........never mind that she married an Armstrong.........and the oldest Armstrong son was also called William...but let's not go there!!!

Monica

[MonicaL]

Judy

Just realised that Charters in Castleton in 1851, this is where her father James Jackson was from, so that would explain why Charters was there.

Monica

[Jeffrey]

Hi Monica,
Hope you received my e-mail but have not done a personal message before so let me know if you have not got it.

Judy

[PRJ]

Agnes  Bell

I  have  an  Agnes  Bell  in  my  Family  tree,  could  this  be  the  same  one?  details  below:

Agnes  Bell  born  circa  1806,  Canonbie

Known  Children  (no  father  listed)
Ann  Bell           1839,  Canonbie
George  Bell      1842/3,  Canonbie

Found  on  1851  Census:
Hallgreen,  Canonbie
Agnes  Bell      (unmarried - head)  44  Agricultural  Labourer
Ann  Bell          (dau)                       12   Scholar
George  Bell     (son)                        8    Scholar

All  born  in  Canonbie
A  possible  death  record:
Agnes  Bell  or  Elliott,  died  1883,  Canonbie,  age  77

My  descent  is  via  Ann  who  married  William  Jardine

Pete

[Jeffrey]

My Agnes Bell was born at Crossdykes in Hutton & Corrie. She married an Anthony Hannah around 1851 and died in Bewcastle Cumberland in 1869.

I know she is not the Agnes Bell on your census as I had wondered if she was at one time but traced her to Ewes in Dumfrieshire - household of Robert Anderson in the 1851 Census.

Judy

[castlebob]

Hello All,
I'm trying to link up various Canonbie Armstrongs & have found a possible link between Robert Armstrong b1833 in Torcoon & a Colonel Robert Armstrong mentioned in the Kansas City Journal - 4th son of Robert Armstrong of Torcoon, farmer. (The Journal entry seems to be dated around 20th April 1877).
This Colonel Armstrong is listed as having a 1200 acre farm in Nemaha County.
Cheers
Bob Armstrong

[Reiver]

Bob,
I've had a look at a couple of indexes.
One is a booklet providing an index to the Canonbie 1851 Census. There is as you may know an on-line index as well.  The second is the Scotland People Index (ie I haven't looked at the images).

From ScotlandsPeople there are two Robert Armstrongs baptised between January 1850 and the end of 1854 in Canonbie  Two Robert Armstrongs are provided - and their parents names are given.   From the index at Torcoon is a 68 yr old Robert who is Head and a 16yd old son David, who is unmarried.  This of course is 1851.
One of the ScotlandsPeople shows a father of one of the Robert's as David - Robert's mother was Hannah.

If you think after your own checking that you have established the right link then you will find that there is a memorial in Canonbie giving another couple of generations back from the 68 yr old Robert above.  In the booklet of Canonbie MIs it is number 315.

Best of luck
Reiver