August 2005 RootsChat Challenge

[cep]

I think I may have tracked down Margaret, Philip's daughter:

1881 Census

A search for Margarets born in Midgeholme threw up:

RG11/5109  Folio 107 Page 13

Halton Lea Gate, Haltwhistle

John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate
Margaret Bell, Wife, b Northumberland, Midgeholme, Lamergost?

and then I found

Marriages June Quarter 1880

John Bell, Bramton 10b 625
Margaret Bell, Brampton 10b 625

Coincidence or something else with Ince** in the word 

Al

There is a Margaret Heslop on the same page of marriages.

However, I conclude that you are probably right.

It appears Somerset is not the only county where villages have a limited number of surnames!


1881:
John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate


1871, no such place as Halton Lea Gate.
Found it under Hartleyburn, where I find:

RG10 5155 20 p13
Haltonlea Gate
Joseph Bell, head, mar, 54, Coal Miner, b. Alston, Cumberland
Elizabeth Bell, wife, mar, 68, b. Aspatria, Cumberland
Isabella Batey, step dau, unm, 46, b. "Do  Alty, Somerset"  ??
Joseph Batey, gran son, unm, 24, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle Nb
John Batey, step g son, unm, 16, Coal Miner, b. Hexham Nb
James Batey, step g son, unm, 12, Coal Miner, b. Newcastle Nb

2 doors down:

John Bell, head, widower, 53, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Mary Ann Bell, dau, unm, 18, General Servant, b. Haltwhistle
John Bell, son, unm, 13, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle

Next page:

John Heslop, head, mar, 50, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Ann Heslop, wife, mar, 51, b. Haltwhistle
Joseph Heslop, son, unm, 24, Coal Miner, b. Greenhead, Cumb
Sarah Heslop, dau, unm, 23, Servant, b. Haltwhistle
John Heslop, son, unm, 20, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Isabella Heslop, dau, unm, 18, b. Haltwhistle
Mathew Heslop, son, unm, 16, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Margaret Heslop, dau, 4, b. Haltwhistle


I WAS going to nominate John Bell, 13, as husband of our Margaret.
But finding him living next door to another possible Margaret, raises doubts.

Anyone else want to puzzle this?


CP

[Holly Golightly]

The births/Christnings of the children I could find :

Thomas: Born - March Qtr 1867 Brampton 10b 392 (FreeBMD)
   Christened - 5th March 1867, Lanercoast Cumberland (IGI)

William: Christened - 13 January 1869, Lanercoast Cumberland (IGI)

Annie: Born - 26 April 1870 (IGI) / June Qtr 1870 Brampton 10b 422 (FreeBMD)
   Christened - 26 Jun 1870, Hastlewith Cumberland (also listed as christened in Lanercoast) (IGI)

Isabella Jane: Born - 11 December 1874 (IGI) /  March Qtr 1875 Brampton 10b 465 (FreeBMD)
   Christened - 20 December 1874, Lanercoast Cumberland (IGI)

Hannah Mary:  Born - 11 December 1874 (IGI) /  March Qtr 1875 Brampton 10b 465 (FreeBMD)
   Christened - 20 December 1874, Lanercoast Cumberland (IGI)

Samuel: Born - June Qtr 1878 Brampton 10b 467 (FreeBMD)

Joseph: Born - December Qtr 1880 Brampton 10b 423 (FreeBMD)

Margaret Elizabeth: Born - June Qtr 1883 Brampton 10b 453 (FreeBMD)

Elsie Miriam: Born - March Qtr 1889 Brampton 10b 453 (FreeBMD)

Holly

[Holly Golightly]

I think I may have tracked down Margaret, Philip's daughter:

1881 Census

A search for Margarets born in Midgeholme threw up:

RG11/5109  Folio 107 Page 13

Halton Lea Gate, Haltwhistle

John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate
Margaret Bell, Wife, b Northumberland, Midgeholme, Lamergost?

and then I found

Marriages June Quarter 1880

John Bell, Bramton 10b 625
Margaret Bell, Brampton 10b 625

Coincidence or something else with Ince** in the word 

Al

There is a Margaret Heslop on the same page of marriages.

However, I conclude that you are probably right.

It appears Somerset is not the only county where villages have a limited number of surnames!


1881:
John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate


1871, no such place as Halton Lea Gate.
Found it under Hartleyburn, where I find:

RG10 5155 20 p13
Haltonlea Gate
Joseph Bell, head, mar, 54, Coal Miner, b. Alston, Cumberland
Elizabeth Bell, wife, mar, 68, b. Aspatria, Cumberland
Isabella Batey, step dau, unm, 46, b. "Do  Alty, Somerset"  ??
Joseph Batey, gran son, unm, 24, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle Nb
John Batey, step g son, unm, 16, Coal Miner, b. Hexham Nb
James Batey, step g son, unm, 12, Coal Miner, b. Newcastle Nb

2 doors down:

John Bell, head, widower, 53, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Mary Ann Bell, dau, unm, 18, General Servant, b. Haltwhistle
John Bell, son, unm, 13, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle

Next page:

John Heslop, head, mar, 50, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Ann Heslop, wife, mar, 51, b. Haltwhistle
Joseph Heslop, son, unm, 24, Coal Miner, b. Greenhead, Cumb
Sarah Heslop, dau, unm, 23, Servant, b. Haltwhistle
John Heslop, son, unm, 20, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Isabella Heslop, dau, unm, 18, b. Haltwhistle
Mathew Heslop, son, unm, 16, Coal Miner, b. Haltwhistle
Margaret Heslop, dau, 4, b. Haltwhistle


I WAS going to nominate John Bell, 13, as husband of our Margaret.
But finding him living next door to another possible Margaret, raises doubts.

Anyone else want to puzzle this?


CP

I dont know if thats the right Margaret Heslop who married 1880. That Margaret would have only been 14 when she married, and looking on the 1881 census I came up with:

 Name  Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
 John HESLOP   Head   M   Male   60   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England   Coal Miner     
 Ann HESLOP   Wife   M   Female   62   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England       
 Margret HESLOP   Grand Daur   U   Female   14   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England   Miners G Daug     


~~~~~~~~
Source Information:
  Dwelling   Engine House
  Census Place Hartleyburn, Northumberland, England
  Family History Library Film   1342234
  Public Records Office Reference   RG11
  Piece / Folio   5109 / 106
  Page Number   12

Holly

NOTE - There is a BATEY family just above them. (Different from 1871 though)

[cep]

I dont know if thats the right Margaret Heslop who married 1880. That Margaret would have only been 14 when she married, and looking on the 1881 census I came up with:

 Name  Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
 John HESLOP   Head   M   Male   60   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England   Coal Miner     
 Ann HESLOP   Wife   M   Female   62   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England       
 Margret HESLOP   Grand Daur   U   Female   14   Engine House Haltlur, Northumberland, England   Miners G Daug     


~~~~~~~~
Source Information:
  Dwelling   Engine House
  Census Place Hartleyburn, Northumberland, England
  Family History Library Film   1342234
  Public Records Office Reference   RG11
  Piece / Folio   5109 / 106
  Page Number   12

Holly

NOTE - There is a BATEY family just above them. (Different from 1871 though)

Good!  That's the kind of checking I need.

Too many Bells in my head at the moment!

Thanks.   CP

[cep]

Anyone interested in background, life in mining villages, etc.

How Green Was My Valley,  book or film.

Set in South Wales, c. 1900, but Northumberland would not be very different.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0033729/


CP

[cep]

Search FreeBMD for Marriages Brampton 1880 10b / 625, gives:

Marriages Jun 1880
Batey    John              Brampton        10b    625     
BELL     John               Brampton        10b    625     
HESLOP   Margaret        Brampton        10b    625 


Search FreeBMD for Marriages Brampton 1880 Margaret Bell, gives:

Marriages Jun 1880
BELL     Margaret Ann    Brampton        10b    525     

Marriages Dec 1880
BELL     Margaret        Brampton        10b    638   


So I got the image from 1837Online.

Margaret Ann Bell is clearly  10b 625

For those who are having difficulty with Margaret Bell
The page should read:

Marriages Jun 1880
Batey    John                Brampton        10b    625     
BELL     John                Brampton        10b    625     
BELL     Margaret Ann    Brampton        10b    625     
HESLOP   Margaret        Brampton        10b    625 


Just when I thought I had this resolved, I notice the Margaret Bell, married Dec quarter, 1880,  and that June quarter is Margaret ANN  ........

And now we have a John Batey in the mix.

There is also a Margaret Bell m. Haltwhistle 1880 Q2  10b 421


My head hurts.        CP

[cep]

I think I may have tracked down Margaret, Philip's daughter:

1881 Census

A search for Margarets born in Midgeholme threw up:

RG11/5109  Folio 107 Page 13

Halton Lea Gate, Haltwhistle

John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate
Margaret Bell, Wife, b Northumberland, Midgeholme, Lamergost?

and then I found

Marriages June Quarter 1880

John Bell, Bramton 10b 625
Margaret Bell, Brampton 10b 625

Coincidence or something else with Ince** in the word 

Al

Trying to eliminate all the other Margaret Bell by age.

I am left with one other possibility

Marriages Dec 1879
Armstrong William        Haltwhistle     10b    423     
Bell     Margaret          Haltwhistle     10b    423     

1881 RG11 5110 30 p1
Thirlwall, Cottage
William Armstrong, head, mar, 33, Stone Mason, b. Haltwhistle
Margaret Armstrong, wife, mar, 19, b. Haltwhistle


But I think Al has the right one.


CP

[Joanna Tolhurst]

I think I may have tracked down Margaret, Philip's daughter:

1881 Census

A search for Margarets born in Midgeholme threw up:

RG11/5109  Folio 107 Page 13

Halton Lea Gate, Haltwhistle

John Bell, Head, 24, Coal Miner, b. Northumberland, Halton Lea Gate
Margaret Bell, Wife, b Northumberland, Midgeholme, Lamergost?

and then I found

Marriages June Quarter 1880

John Bell, Bramton 10b 625
Margaret Bell, Brampton 10b 625

Coincidence or something else with Ince** in the word 

Al

Can we find this pair in a later census to see if any children or visitors can confirm that she is Philip's daughter?  I've had a quick look to no avail.

Jo

[Joanna Tolhurst]

Took the photos away - wrong Featherstone colliery.  there's one  near Wakefield which is not the one where Anthony died.
Photos on next posting still give us an idea of the life though.