Author Topic: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire  (Read 37313 times)

Offline tidybooks

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #63 on: Tuesday 13 June 17 23:13 BST (UK) »
Hi Forfarian,

Yes, I am having difficulty proving them to be correct family. I think the "Linlithgow" in the passenger list, can be place or county of residence rather than birthplace.

Here is link to Passenger List: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ourstuff/Strathnaver.htm, have a look you may agree.

May try tracing the 11yo Isabella, not sure the relationship to William Henderson yet.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Re: Hendersons from Bo'ness
« Reply #64 on: Tuesday 13 June 17 23:25 BST (UK) »
I have been looking into this family trying to prove what I think is fact, i.e. that William 24 and John 20 are brothers.

I agreed with that initially as the 'likely family' but now with more investigation by Forfarian although they seem to be brothers they don't appear to be the correct family  ???

There seems to be a bit of a mystery here with different areas all over the place  ::)

From Peter's original post;

"William Henderson  born 1849 bo'ness linlithgowshire (details from himself)
 margaret casey from  newton  glasgow
 marriage 23 june 1872 at crofthead lanarkshire
 her father was william casey and mother was Mary"


Newton (Cambuslang)? & Crofthead (Carnwath)? appear to both be in South Lanarkshire although I can find no birth for Margaret, no marriage nor a birth for the 'John' aged 1 yr on the passenger list either in Lanarkshire or Linlithgowshire  ???

Peter,

It may be an idea to post some queries for this family on the NZ board as there are good researchers on there to see if anymore info. regarding Scotland & their roots can be found?

Annie

Added, I had already started typing this out prior to your post Tom
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #65 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 00:09 BST (UK) »
Death of Isabella Mitchell Henderson;

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KFX9-2HC

Buried Uphall, West Lothian 1912 (b c1842)

There does seem to be names which match family names & a possible West Lothian connection?

Maybe William was the 'Black Sheep'  ::)

Annie

Added....

HENDERSON ISABELLA 70
1912
672/ 107
Uphall

MITCHELL ISABELLA 70
1912
672/ 107
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Re: Hendersons from Bo'ness
« Reply #66 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 10:13 BST (UK) »
Newton (Cambuslang)? & Crofthead (Carnwath)? appear to both be in South Lanarkshire
Don't go down that road unless you want to confuse things further.

As I have already pointed out there are several different places called Crofthead in Lanarkshire. Newton is an even commoner place name than Crofthead, and Cambuslang is not in Glasgow. It is an entirely separate parish and doesn't even have a mutual boundary with Glasgow. 

As far as I can tell, you have three sources of information.

One is the transcription of the passenger list from the 'Strathnaver' which lists William, a miner, of Linlithgow, aged 24; Margaret, 20; John, 1; John, 20, unmarried; Isabella, 11. As other passengers' listings contain the county they came from, I agree that it is reasonable to suppose that in this case Linlithgow means the County of Linlithgow, that is, West Lothian.

Next is Margaret's death certificate which says she died on 14 September 1934, aged 81; that her parents were William Casey, miner, and Mary, surname unknown; she was first married at 18 in Scotland to William Henderson and had 9 surviving children, aged 61, 59, 53, 50, 49, 47, 46 and 40

Also you have a supposed date for the marriage of William and Margaret, on 23 June 1872 at Crofthead, which is not matched by anything in the Scotland's People database or the index to that database at FamilySearch.

- What is the source for this marriage date?

You listed William and Margaret's children as William b 26 February 1877, Margaret b 7 September 1879, Peter b 28 March 1881, Isabella b 25 December 1883 and James b 29 June 1890, which is five. Add on John, who was aged 1 when they arrived in New Zealand, and that makes six. So there must have been at least three more to make up the 9 surviving at her death. Possibly more if one or more children predeceased their mother.

The NZ birth records list 22 children with surname Henderson, father William and mother Margaret. Four can be eliminated because one or other parent had a middle name, leaving 18 whose father was plain William and mother plain Margaret.
John, 1874
Mary, 1875
Margaret Ann, 1875
John Dunnett, 1875
George, 1876
William, 1877
William, 1877
Elizabeth, 1877
Margaret, 1879
Alexander Meanock, 1879
Peter, 1881
Benjamina Jessie, 1882
James, 1883
Isabella, 1884
William Alexander Procter, 1885
Amelia Florence, 1886
Elizabeth Anne, 1888
James, 1890
From the dates there have to be at least two different families, possibly three or more, but I can't sort them out from the NZ birth indexes. Maybe someone with better knowledge of how the NZ registers are organised might be able to tell?

Now for a bit of speculation. It could be, for instance, that Mary b 1875 is also their daughter, named after Margaret's mother. Mary would have been 59 in 1934, which is an exact match for a daughter of Margaret's listed on her death certificate.

If so, then their first four children were John, Mary, William and Margaret. First daughter named for mother's mother and second son named for mother's father? If so, William's parents would have been John and Margaret.

Their daughter Margaret b 1879 would have been 55 when her mother Margaret nee Casey died, so it looks as if Margaret b 1879 may have predeceased her mother.

Could the son aged 49 then be William Alexander Procter, and if so, why the middle names?

And was the 46-year-old daughter Elizabeth Anne?

Also, there is no birth of a Barbara, and it was their sixth son who was named James, so from this evidence also I don't think it's likely that William was the grandson of Barbara Smith.

There are far too many Isabella Hendersons in the Scottish birth indexes in 1862/1863 who could be the 11-year-old one in the ship passenger list.




Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.


Offline tidybooks

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #67 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 10:42 BST (UK) »
Hi Forfarian and all,

Yes, I couldn't agree more. The passenger list could be a different family, it has similarities to what is assumed accurate. However is not as comprehensive as some passenger lists, like Ellis Island etc. I cannot find a definite William Henderson in 1871 census, 3 years prior to emigrating. I found an Art Student lodging in Coatbridge, not a miner and not in Linlithgowshire.

I have searched Scotsman Newspapers Archives for notices of births or marriages, but drew a blank.

The lack of marriage certificate of William Henderson in Scotland People website and in LDS Family Search site is worrying. I did a search on the 11yo Isabella, from passenger list, using Henderson as surname, but far too many to pin down, as you state.

The death certificate of Margaret O'Connell nee Casey is only definite thing to go on, but we cannot trace any proof of her birth or being in census.

It is never easy, but feel we need some definite facts from New Zealand end.

Tom

Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #68 on: Wednesday 14 June 17 11:09 BST (UK) »
It is never easy, but feel we need some definite facts from New Zealand end.
Yes.

First we need to know where the date and place of marriage information came from.

Also, given that Peter says that William did a runner and might have returned to Scotland, the obvious next step is a trawl for possible deaths of William Henderson b c 1849/1850. (This might also definitely eliminate the schoolmaster's son if he stayed in Scotland and died here.) Unfortunately a search for deaths of William Henderson, born 1850 plus or minus three years, between 1890 and 1960, produces 117 results, which is too much to go through online. It wouldn't take a huge amount of time in the SP centre if someone was planning a visit there.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline kiwican

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #69 on: Thursday 15 June 17 02:22 BST (UK) »
thanks for helping me with this jig saw puzzle to put it all together with my eyes being so bad its hard for me to look at a ipad too long to do much my self it is much apprcretiated what you are doing  from peter

Offline bitzar

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #70 on: Thursday 15 June 17 02:34 BST (UK) »
Hi team

I've been watching from afar...

Could Isabella be aged 11 months, not 11 years?!

bitzar.
ROBERTS / ROBERT / ROBERTSON (Paternal) - Dunbartonshire/Stirlingshire, Scotland
NEWEY - Leicestershire, England
FITZGERALD - Co. Cork - Ireland
HOWLETT - Suffolk, England
PHILMORE - Wiltshire, England
CHAPMAN - Cornwall - England
NICHOLLS - Cornwall - England
SHAW - Nottinghamshire, England
PRITCHARD - Salop, England
ROBERTS (Maternal) - Surrey, England

Offline Rosinish

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Re: Hendersons of Linlithgowshire
« Reply #71 on: Thursday 15 June 17 02:50 BST (UK) »
Could Isabella be aged 11 months, not 11 years?!

Good observation but...

I would have reservations as there's quite a few passengers who's ages are clearly written as months but errors do occur i.e. not impossible but....

If this was 'their' daughter aged 11 months it's a bit close to a son aged 1 yr but.....

We have no confirmation of the relationships of the Hendersons on that ship yet.

Annie

South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"