Marian Rendall

[lydiaann]

Back in June 2014, I requested information on the McTavish family and "manawakian" kindly sent me links to the life and career of William McTavish of Dunardry who worked for the HBC, eventually becoming a governor.  This set me on track to find his family who returned to the Orkneys (or rather were sent by him as he was apparently 'marrying' again). [Many thanks, manawakian

William married Marian Rendall "according to the custom of the country", possibly around 1840-1843 (the eldest child, William, was born in 1843),  and I am trying to find out her story.  I have no dates of birth, marriage nor death, nor do I know where she was born nor where she died.  Although I have full knowledge of 3 of the 4 children that were sent to the Orkneys, I do not know when they travelled and thus whether or not their mother travelled with them.  However, as she is not listed in the 1861 or 1871 censuses on Orkney (as are the children), I am assuming that she stayed in Canada?

Thanks
lydiaann

[Jacquie in Canada]

Links to previous threads of lydiaann's which has information about William McTavish:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=673471
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=674044.0

Jacquie

[dishep]

Finding information on Marian/Margaret will likely only be linked to her marriages and children unless her father had her baptized ... Wesleyan Methodist records from York Factory (Diocese of Keewatin).  It will take a lot of reading of post records to find casual references to her.  If her husbands were post masters, they may make reference to their family in the post journals.  If husbands served in other capacities, there may be no references at all.  At one point in the history of the company, these "country marriages" were not acknowledged as they were not "allowed."  This book focuses on those woman involved in those country marriages (only reference to John Rendall not Betsy) and provides a good understanding of the reality:
https://books.google.ca/books/about/Many_Tender_Ties.html?id=JBAp4KhDrdUC
https://www.amazon.ca/Many-Tender-Ties-Fur-Trade-1670-1870/dp/189623951X

Here's a tidbit found in the Letters from Letitia (McTavish) Hargrave found by another researcher:
https://www.geni.com/people/Betsy/6000000023895658610

Letitia Hargrave's letters (one of the published sources):
http://www.furtradestories.ca/details.cfm?content_id=169&cat_id=2&sub_cat_id=3

The McTavish children sent home to the Orkneys likely went home with their father or were sent to the father's kin.  This would be a rare occurance unless their father was in a higher position in the company that could get permission to send the children on the ships and also have the money to do so.  There was a small group of children that were sent to the Orkneys from other fathers...perhaps they were sent to lodge with one of those families that had "mixed-blood" children.  McTavish sending his children to the UK is a fairly rare event as some husbands just walked away or gave the wife to another man in country ...

[dishep]

Another good book that gives you an idea of these country marriages by Jennifer Brown:
https://books.google.ca/books/about/Strangers_in_Blood.html?id=AiY5BtaCKvoC&redir_esc=y

The native women and their "mixed blood" children were not always treated well.  Some men proved to be very loving husbands/fathers who remained in HBC lands and made provisions for his family in a will.  These men were fairly rare; others felt these country marriages did not count and "legally" married women from the UK or Canada and ignored the existance of their "country" families.

[lydiaann]

Many thanks for all those links...I shall enjoy reading them - but tomorrow now as it's time for a cuppa!

Thanks again, all this information is very much appreciated.

[dishep]

Article from Canadian Georgraphic on the Metis of Orkney.  Metis is the term originally used to identify children of French and Indigenous Canadians.  The term was extended to include children of HBC employees and their Indigenous spouses.  http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/METISGEN/2008-03/1206495274

If you want to research HBC documents further for information of the Rendall, Mactavish connection, a copy of the HBC archives appears to be on microfilm at Kew.  Since John Rendall was a post master at York and Severn (per his bio https://www.gov.mb.ca/chc/archives/hbca/biographical/r/rendall_john1820-1866.pdf), you should be able to view post journals and other documents written by his own hand through the HBC collection at Kew.   It is possible he mentions his wife Betsy and daughter Marian.  Be prepared for a lot of reading.

As to whether Marian went to the Orkneys with her children, you likely would have to search the Bills of Health under Ship miscellaneous records.  These were completed so ship would not be quarantined in London on arrival. https://www.gov.mb.ca/chc/archives/hbca/resource/ship_rec/types.html

The HBC Archives Winnipeg list the materials related to York Factory https://www.gov.mb.ca/chc/archives/hbca/resource/post_rec/post17.html
Not sure if the same referencing scheme is used at Kew but the post journals that may contain info about him or written by him are referenced as B.239/a/136-156

Bio and photo of William Mactavish http://www.biographi.ca/en/bio/mactavish_william_9E.html  He married a Mary Sarah McDermot, Metis daughter of Andrew McDermot of Red River.
There is mention of his "illegitimate" children in his will.  Somerset House (London), PPR/334, will of William Mactavish (copy at HBC Arch.).

[dishep]

Read through your earlier posts again ..." census" for fur trade posts were kept in individual post journals and only contained a listing of the names of the employees and are exclusive to the HBC archives.  If there were wives and children they were often mentioned in generic terms ie. wife and 4 children. 

Births may/may not be mentioned in the post journal but usually in terms of generics ie "Grant's girl delivered child today".  Births would have been recorded if the child was baptized and would be in the records of the church they were affiliated with.  In the early history of Rupert's Land, particularly in the Hudson Bay area, Anglican and Wesleyan Methodist missionaries were the religious groups allowed in (as they had to come in on HBC ships).   Ontario Archives has this finding aid: http://ao.minisisinc.com/LISTS/F%20978.pdf
Moose Factory has the oldest records - Anglican from 1780 & Methodist from 1840 ; York Factory Anglican records start 1846.
There was a Mission school in Moose Factory which was started in the late 1840s/early 1850s IIRC.  Some HBC employees (called servants) sent their children there and paid for boarding; others sent children to Canada or the UK if they had the financial means.

The first official census for this area would be from 1870 after the transfer of lands from the HBC to Canada.  Too late to be of assistance to you...

Genealogy in this geographic area is not for the faint of heart ... a lot of reading in multiple post documents that may turn up very little information.  Your best bet would be accessing HBC records from Kew.   I wish you the best of luck on the search!

[Skoosh]

Have you tried,   http://www.cursiter.com   

Skoosh.

[lydiaann]

Skoosh, no I haven't.  I'll have a go a little later.  I think this particular site may be helpful in tracing one of the daughters of Marian Rendall and Duncan McTavish (Margaret)...I have her up to the 1871 census but then she seems to disappear.  This site may certainly help.

Thanks everyone for all your input.  I do have a lot of the information already but some of it was new to me - and very useful too!  Despite the fact that the Rendalls and McTavishes are secondary 'twigs' (i.e. by marriage to a blood relation), they are most interesting.  Sadly, the McTavishes are also quite tragic, 3 of 4 of the children dying quite early.  I fear they were in poor condition when they arrived back in the Orkneys and the harsh living conditions thereafter would take their toll.  Very sad.

Thanks again, Chatters!

lydiaann