Was he really dead or legally on that date?

[McGroger]

Thanks again, Ros. Back on air, I'll get into a bit of the Inquest searching you were doing.

And thanks, Jamjar. So sad; too often we forget how lucky we are today compared with a lot of people in those days.
 
Peter

[McGroger]

Disappointing response from AWM:

“Thank you for your request for information on the death of your father’s uncle.

“All the information that we have on individual soldiers is located in their personal service record. Any additional post-war information would be held by the relevant state registry of Births Deaths and Marriages.

“They should able to assist your family research.”

I’ve sent an email to NSW BDM. I wonder if I’ll get a similar lazy response.

Cheers, Peter

[majm]

I am very disappointed to read that response.  I have had much better responses from them, but several years ago now.   It seems a part of the 'Australian Ethos' has gone missing.   I do not expect you will receive a positive email from NSW BDM.   Weasel words and gobbledygook seems to be their current offerings. 

I will pull thinking cap down harder.   

JM

[Jamjar]

Peter,

It translates as: Bugger, I have no idea where to look, so will pass him on to someone else. 

Jamjar

[Rosinish]

  

Your right JJ. "Pass the buck"!!!

Annie

[rosball]

That's a shame Peter.

I wonder if it's worth e-mailing NSW state records info@records.nsw.gov.au   The staff there are always so helpful and any e-mails I have sent have received a very quick informative response. 

Of course this may not be something which they can help with but maybe worth a try.

Ros

[McGroger]

Thanks JM, Jamjar, Annie and Ros.

Ros, thanks for the tip. Just sent them an email, too.

Cheers, Peter

[judb]

I'm wondering if there are records of applications to have someone declared dead. Clutching at straws a bit here but I note that in reply #105 Peter says
The date recorded on his service file, “Died 18 April 1937” looks suspiciously like he was declared dead as of that date, it being almost exactly 7 years since he first deserted Effie.

This appears to be the current position but it seems to address administration of estates.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declared_death_in_absentia
To address the possibility that a missing person may in fact be deceased, the Probate and Administration Act (NSW) 1898 allows the Supreme Court of New South Wales to apply a presumption of death subject to certain evidence being provided. As a general rule, if a person has not been seen or heard from for a period of 7 years by people who would normally be in contact with the missing person, the Court may apply a presumption of death and grant the executor authority to administer the estate. Certain situations may give rise to a presumption of death due to the manner of disappearance, and if the circumstances warrant it, the Court may find it unnecessary to require the full 7 year period to pass.
Would there have been any estate in this case to require probate?

I'm not sure that the AWM holds any individual service records so I think their reply is probably 'true'.

Judith

[majm]

Yes Judith  . 

I suggested the AWM as CW Bean was offered as a possible for 'Historian' and the actual AIF file shows that the 'Historian' was the person giving the DD to the clerk who added the info to page 41 of 41 of the AIF file.   My experiences with the AWM are similar to the experiences Ros mentions with the NSW State Records.   I had always found that the AWM staff were prepared to follow up particularly when it came to WWI service records.   I will assume that the current poor response is simply because of the passage of time .... ie the person who would have 'known' the correct answer has retired or no longer is a volunteer there.   

Yes too Judith re presumed deaths in NSW, definitely any declaration re any presumed NSW death would have been via NSW Supreme Court.    I have searched TROVE for such for Donald and I have had no success. 

He is hiding.

Peter,

did you ask the direct question "Can you please advise me as to who is the 'Historian' as mentioned at page 41 of 41 of the AIF service file at the following live link ..............., " That directness can sometimes be the 'carrot' to entice the researcher into deep and meaningful researching. 

Legal declarations for Death .....   (Order of Presumed Death)

Info from a rellie (retired NSW BDM senior officer not sure if it is Order of Death or Order of Presumed Death)

If the death was presumed to have occurred in NSW, what should have been done would be court  action taken in the NSW Supreme Court by his wife/widow/divorced wife with outstanding child maintenance orders/etc or others having a claim on his "deceased" estate, Solicitor/Barrister representing the Parties seeking the declaration.,,. 

The SMH newspaper would have displayed the Law Lists for any such action.  So check TROVE

If such action was successful, then there should be a direction from the Supreme Court to the Registrar General, causing a NSW dc to be raised.   

 I cannot see any likely NSW BDM dc indexed for 1937/38 .....   

JM