FRANCE: Marriage in Rouen 1916-1919

[janbal]

Hope you can help me. I am trying to find a marriage in Rouen for my sister in law. Her grandfather Arthue James Withers(B Wanstead 1893) came to Aust and enlisted WW1. Said to have married in Rouen during war to Madeline Odette Fouquer between 1916 -1919. Her address was given as 118 Rue Benjamin Normand on his military papers.

Thankyou

[jorose]

Hello,

I've split your message off as although both families were from Rouen this appears to be a separate family.

I checked the military papers for Arthur James Withers and I believe the address is in Sotteville-lès-Rouen (now considered a suburb of Rouen).  He made a next of kin change (page 27 of his file) 12th Feb 1918, so marriage probably around that point.

http://stk.smct.org.au/deceasedsearch/result/347325
 - judging from age at death, Madeline was born about 1900

As stated in the other thread, a marriage around the time of WWI will not be online, but you may be able to find her birth at http://recherche.archivesdepartementales76.net with a marginal note referring to the marriage.

Her birth does not appear, however, to be in Rouen or Sotteville-les-Rouen, her family could be elsewhere in the region.  Do you have her Australian death certificate and is any additional information about her family or her exact birthplace given there?

[sss65]

I was hoping you would pick this one up Jorose as you managed to sort out my query! i did try to see if I could find her birth but couldn't work out how to search an index quickly.
Good luck Janbal!

[jorose]

https://online.justice.vic.gov.au/bdm/indexsearch.doj
I've just partially answered my own question; her index entry here lists her parents as Eugene Fouquer and Augustine (nee ?).

Also present in the indexes:
Eugene Arsene Fouquer, d. 1953 aged 87, b. St Germain, France,  father "Alphons", mother Rose Adelair nee Delanne
Augustine Louise Fouquer, d. 1953 aged 87, born "France", father Octave Mutrel, mother Cesarine De Poulin

Australia Recordsearch shows Augustine Fouquer (born 24 Jun 1870) and Odette Fouquer (born Sep 29 1902) both arrived on the Osterley around 1920, as well as the naturalisation of Eugene Arsene (now said to be born Aupreau)

"Odette" was a sister to Madeline:
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/23248784?searchTerm=Fouquer


Now, Saint-Germaine suggests the nearby department of Eure, and I found Eugene Arsene (Arsene Eugene) there  ( http://archives.cg27.fr/ ) in the military records of 1885 (should be the year he turned 20), Bureau of Bernay, register 1 entry 340

Hopefully this works:
http://archives.cg27.fr/img-viewer/registres_matricules/BERNAY_1885_40R30/viewer.html
 and image 357

Most importantly for figuring out his daughter's birth and marriage locations, this gives us an idea of where he lived over the years. He was resident Pont Audemer when he signed up (1885), and then:

1891, Lieurey
1892, Pont Audemer
1894 onwards, Rouen (south)

But I still can't see either of the Forquer girls in Rouen...

[jorose]

Ah, never mind, I believe I have solved it.

Both girls appear to have been registered under their mother's maiden name in Rouen:

Madeleine Odette Mutrel was registered 28 October 1899
Odette Emma Mutrel was registered 1 December 1902

Odette's birth is not available online yet but Madeleine's is (hope this link works, page 122)
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hrj/

She is listed as Madeleine Odette Marguerite Mutrel, born on the 25th October to Augustine Alexandrine Mutrel, single woman, born 15 Jun 1869 Saint-Jean-de-la-Lequeraye, Eure.

There's no marginal note as to her marriage, but there is a marginal note referencing the date 7th May 1906 which I think might be about an act of recognizance (upon her mother's marriage).

You could try contacting the Mairie of Rouen for a copy of the marriage certificate (presuming it did take place in Rouen):
http://www.annuaire-mairie.fr/acte-de-mariage-rouen.html

It is not uncommon for a Mairie to take several weeks (at times months) to respond to such requests, depending on their workload, but they do so eventually. If the marriage can not be found in Rouen, try  contacting Sotteville-les-Rouen.

[janbal]

Many thanks for all your information. I have actually found some of that, all the Australian things. I also found the marriage of Withers & Mutrel on Ancestry - UK Foreign & Overseas Registers. Have also been looking through the registers at the Archives of Seine Maritime and found the index of her birth registration but not all that info you sent. I haven't yet followed up all your suggestions but I will. I am most appreciative of all you have done. My sister in law is going to be very happy
I have successfully seen the military records but not able to open the
Link for Madeleine's birth. Is there any other way I can access that?

[janbal]

Just a bit more to add. According to my sister in law, the family knew Madeleine was illegitimate and it was a source of embarrassment to family. But they were under the impression that Odette was step sister, but from your information,that doesn't seem the case. Madeleine apparently spent a number of unhappy years in a convent so perhaps both girls were there. The family assumed Eugene Fouquet and  Augustine Mutrel married about 1901 and then Odette born. Both girl's death certificates give Eugene and Augustine as parents. But with the information that you have sent there is obviously much more we have to find out. It would also seem that some of the females changed their Christian names. Odette Emma was known I as Odette Madeleine Jacqueline by family and her mother Augustine  Alexandrine became Augustine Louise. All very intriguing !!

[janbal]

I have not been able to access the link for Madeleine' birth . Is it available on any other web site or is there any way you could send a copy of the relevant p122?

[jorose]

These records are only available through the departmental archives as far as I know.
Try from the start, although this website is not very easy to navigate:
http://recherche.archivesdepartementales76.net/?id=recherche_guidee_etat_civil

commune: Rouen
period entire: 1899 to 1900, say.
You are looking for:
1899/10/02 - 1899/11/20 (4E 13920)
Rouen > Registres Etat Civil > Naissances

For this single record it might be easier to go:
http://recherche.archivesdepartementales76.net/?id=recherche_simple
and just search for 4E 13920

Click on the result, and then when the new page opens up, click again on the image where it says "Documents numérisés : 203 documents".

A new window opens up. There should be a slider at the bottom to access image number 122.

Given that they were born a couple years apart, and that you've found Madeleine's marriage under "Mutrel", it is possible that Madeleine and Odette had different fathers, and Augustine then married Eugene after Odette's birth, hence the family knowing them as step-sisters. Clearly in Australia the family knew Eugene as Madeleine's father, hence him being on her death certificate.