John Edward Blake

[rosball]

Aaaargh!     

Thanks JM    I'm not good with microfilm anyway so would take years.     Yes I know there are only 4 permutations of ways to load the reels but it still takes me 12 or so attempts before I manage it.

I wonder when FindMyPast will have another free weekend 

Very interesting about the cricketers 

[thistlebay]

Hi Ros and JM
Another wow on all that info!  Its very interesting and I agree, I hate reels of films too!  So when you say they are logged numerically JM, for instance I would need the Series 4, the wills are not kept in date order but the number issued to the will at the time?  So wills that were not administered and granted could still be in the will books?  Does this also mean that ALL wills made had to be registered?  Yes very interesting about the cricketers.
I don't have a Findmypast sub either  but did make use of the free weekend a few short weeks ago but alas I didn't know about wills on there, so yes, I'll just have to wait for that free weekend again.  There is still free Irish parish records on Ancestry.com at the moment too which have been great, before now you had to go into the Irish Archives online and search through hundreds of them to find what you needed but they are now in the process of transcribing them so you just enter name of person you are searching for and hey presto, there it is! This offer is on til I think, end of this month.
Thanks to both once more.
Catherine

[thistlebay]

I just took a quick look at findmypast will books to see if I could find John Edward Blake death 1952 (even though I wouldn't be able to access the record) and nothing is coming up for him so maybe he didn't write a will after all.
Regards
Catherine

[majm]

The NSW Supreme Court does NOT have wills that were NOT presented for Probate.   The Will Books do NOT contain wills UNLESS they were already proven by the NSW Supreme Court.

The NSW State Records reels are allocated NSW State Records reference numbers by the staff at NSW State Records. 

I cannot find where I wrote that they are logged numerically.   But I can assure you that the Archives Investigator's search engine finds the Probate Packets by keyword. 

In NSW when a deceased estate did NOT NEED to be proven, it was not presented for probate at the NSW Supreme Court.  In those instances, if a solicitor had held that will, then the solicitor would likely assist/oversee the administration of the estate by the executor named in that will.     The solicitor would likely retain all the paperwork, including the will.  Those files are not public records, so are NOT normally lodged with the NSW State Archives.   

Cheers,  JM     

[thistlebay]

Thanks for clarifying JM.
So if a will did not need to be proven, probate was not needed?  Its all very confusing for me about probate etc.  So the executor, if close to the deceased would probably also have a copy of the will and then inform the solicitor of the death.  So in this particular case, it is likely that the relative he lived with would have been the executor of his will, if, he made one?
So it really is unlikely I will find the will even if there was one made by the deceased.

On another note, I wonder if you could answer another question for me JM?
There was a property sold in 1941 in Gundagai, I'm not sure what the situation was when the company took possession and why, but the Permanent Trustee Co Ltd, took possession of the property in November 1940 and they sold the property in March 1941, is there any way  of finding out the details of this sale at all, ie, who sold it to the company and who eventually bought it from the company?
Kind regards
Catherine

[thistlebay]

Sorry but one more question.
I just re-read the will of the aunt who died who actually owned the property I just spoke of, but I thought she had left this property to her nephew John Blake, maybe not, maybe this property was the one which had to be sold under the terms of Elizabeth's will.  She does state in her will that John Edward lives with her (the will was written in 1926) and that she has already transferred to him a farm worth approximately £4000.  So it could be that it was a different place other than 'The Elms' that she gave him, The Elms being the property sold in 1941.
It states on the front of the will, probate was granted to Norman Baylis Mackenzie one of the executors appointed under the will and codicil.  Thomas Sullivan on the executors renounced probate and Ralph Mate Thompson the other executor predeceased the testatrix.
Does this mean that Thomas Sullivan renounced his authority as executor?
I am now beginning to wonder if this is the estate which Elizabeth  wanted converted into money to be shared as soon as possible after her death, but if that is case, why did it take over 5 years to sell it from her death in 1935 to it being sold in 1941?
Any ideas?
Catherine

[rosball]

Do you just have her will Catherine?  Or the whole probate packet?   The probate packet should give details of the properties she owned and the value of each. 

But I would have expected that the will made very clear what was to happen to each property....?

I can photograph her probate packet too if you don't have it.

regards
  Ros
(adding : planning to go on Monday)

[majm]

Hi there,

Ros is offering to photograph the entire Probate Packet, and I agree it is very likely that will provide answers to your questions.

In rural NSW, in the 20th century, if a solicitor drew up a will, it is likely that the solicitor held the original document.    The executor did not need to be related to the deceased, (and still does not need to be related).    "Probate" is the court order that "proves" at law that a Will is valid.  A Will can of course be valid without needing a court to prove it is valid.   

 https://www.lawsociety.com.au/community/publicationsandfaqs/BeinganExecutor/index.htm

In rural NSW, these small communities were frequently catching up with each other via activities such as Sunday Church services,  Hospital Board Meetings,  Pastures Protection Board meetings, District Ambulance Volunteers,  Fire Brigade,  etc.  (Add :  Sales Yards,  Mail contractor deliveries including groceries, medicines etc not just postal articles,  School children bringing messages, )

The death of a community member would have become known very quickly .... "Word of Mouth" .... (ADD .... don't forget that in NSW, Doctor needed to sign off on cause of death before the funeral director could proceed, so various experienced people  involved in the practical issues, and usually just one or two funeral directors in a township, so they would communicate with each other in a commonsense way, without needing to ask for written authority from the next of kin before hand.  Solicitors and/or clergy would often be called on to inform extended family of the death, and would be able to provide funeral arrangements. )

Cheers,  JM

[cupoflife]

This has certainly been a very interesting post. Hopefully the probate packet will be a juicy one, full of detailed information to answer some of the probing questions. Please post an update on the forum for those following with great interest.