British Army - enlistment duration between the wars

[JJENG]

Hello - hope someone can help. My uncle had left the King's Own Yorkshire Light Infantry by 1935 to return to civvy street.  Born in 1906, I think he enlisted at a fairly young age in the early 1920s - what was the rules regarding enlistment duration between the wars and how old did you have to be? Many thanks!

[km1971]

For Regulars - in the 1920s it was still 12 years after the age of 18. It was made up of so many years in uniform with the rest in the First Class Army Reserve. In order to spend all 12 years in uniform a man had to be in possession of two Good Conduct badges. You will need to ask in the WW2 section if this was still the case in the late 1930s.

Reservists could extend their time by four years after their '12' was up. Men in uniform for the first 12 years could extend to 21 years with permission, Reservists only very rarely recorded the fact on BMDs, census etc. They only served two weeks a year. A Regular enlisting on his 18th birthday or sooner would have still been a soldier until at least his 30th birthday even when he put another occupation on official forms.

Ken

[JJENG]

Ken - that is really useful...many thanks! I am researching his service history and his daughter is getting his service record from MOD for me.  I have a news cutting about him recuperating from a shrapnel wound serving with the KOYLIs with BEF in France in 1940 with the rank of Company Sergeant Major.   It also says that he served in India for 7 years in the past.  I understand he worked as a blacksmith from at least 1935 until his re-enlistment. Did regular soldiers retain their rank as a First Class Reservist? If so, this would account for him taking on the rank of CSM so soon after re-enlistment.  I assume he got the two 'good service' badges. I am keen to source the best information about the history of the KOYLIs during his engagement with them if you can help. Thanks again - John.

[MaxD]

The research area of the KOYLI museum would be worth a look if you haven't already done it. Brief overview of 1939-45 at http://www.britisharmedforces.org/li_pages/regiments/koyli/kingyork_ww2.htm, presumably he was 1st Bn if he was in France in 1940.

maxD

[JJENG]

maxD - thanks for your advice about researching the KOYLIs history.  Yes i will probably visit the Museum once I get his service history.  Agree he was probably part of the 1st Battalion in France. I have photos of him with KOYLIs in Iceland in 1940, so almost certainly joined 1/4th Battalion after recuperating from the shrapnel foot injury.  Thanks again!

[km1971]

I doubt that he would be a CSM after seven years. He may have been a Corporal while a Reservist. Then promoted soon after rejoining.

Ken

[JJENG]

Ken - After enlistment at a young age, I am assuming that he served for 12 years, that included 7 years in India. I agree that he may have been promoted to CSM after re-enlistment at the outbreak of war. Why Corporal and not Sergeant? I appreciate your expert help.

[km1971]

He may have made Sergeant. But such a high flyer is likely to have stayed in uniform for the full 12 years. He could not have been a time-served blacksmith so would not have earned more as a civilian compared to being a senior NCO.

It would be clearer if you can give the exact date of birth and when in 1935 you have him as a civilian. If he was under 30 for the latter he had to have been transferred to the Army Reserve. If you have addresses for the late 1930s you can always check the electoral roll.

One more complication is that, if he was overseas when he had completed his time in uniform, the army had the right to keep him for a further year. It is not always possible to work out exactly what happened, without paying the MOD for his record. For that they may want a copy of his death certificate.

Ken

[JJENG]

Ken - Actually on checking the news cutting it describes my uncle (Edward Patrick Carthy) as an 'iron moulder' not a blacksmith!  The earliest date I have of him in civvy street is getting married in May 1935 lving in Skipton in Craven and described as a 'blacksmith's striker'.  His DoB was 29/10/1906 at Chiswick, London.  He left home shortly after his mother died in 1918 and worked as a farm hand in Yorkshire before joining up.  Probably served for 12 years sometime between the years 1920 - 1935, which included 7 years in India.  His daughter in Australia has his North West Frontier Medal 1930-31 and India General Service Medal, in addition to WW2 medals. She is applying for his Service Record, so I can write a full and detailed 'profile' about his service career.  Really appreciate your help.