Manchester Vernon / Portner / Cohen

[JustinL]

A quick look on FreeBMD throws up:

Myer Valensky, b. Q2 1921 Manchester
Eric Valensky, b. Q1 1923 Salford

Their mother's maiden name was Brown.

Eric Vernon, who died in Manchester in Aug 2000, was born on 6 Jan 1923, i.e. Q1 1923

[cohenvernonportner]

The death record for JJC merely reports that he did not die at home. He died while on Bury New Road. Maybe he simply had a heart attack, or was hit by a car. It is hardly a surprise that someone who died that young, did not die at home. My mother's father died of a heart attack at the same age on the platform at St. Alban's rail station.

Betsy Portner's birth was registered in Q2 1902. Here are two possible deaths for her:

Bessie Cohen, bom ? Mar 1902, died Q3 1970 (death registered in Bury)
Bessie Cohen, born 18 Jan 1902, died Q1 1981 (death registered in Manchester)

Either one is a very long time after JJC's death.

Thank you for clarifying I thought you meant he was at a different address on Bury New Road.

So I need to find out which is the correct Bessie as the gravestone info from earlier was>
Joseph Jacob Cohen 1948 Rainsough
Betsy Cohen 1946 Rainsough

which does not correspond with what we have now. There are so many Bessies and betsys and jacks/jacobs and josephs all in the same area it is difficult!

[cohenvernonportner]

A quick look on FreeBMD throws up:

Myer Valensky, b. Q2 1921 Manchester
Eric Valensky, b. Q1 1923 Salford

Their mother's maiden name was Brown.

Was Browns first name henrietta/ hetty?

So perhaps Myer is the brother of Eric , Can we find out any more about Myer?

[cohenvernonportner]

http://munksroll.rcplondon.ac.uk/Biography/Details/6649


Ben and ann? But only 3 children ten grandchildren

[JustinL]

Henrietta Brown married Samuel Vellensky in the South Broughton Synagogue in Q2 1920.

Samuel was born in Q1 1893 in Manchester to Hyman Levy Vellensky (b. 1866 Poland, d. 1927), a tailor, and Sara née Levy (b. 1868 London, d. 1929).

Hyman and Sarah had married in Manchester's Great Synagogue in Q1 1887.

I have also found the following two death records:

Samuel Vernon, b. 26 Feb 1893, d. Q1 1974 Manchester
Henrietta Vernon, b. 15 Feb 1895, d. Q1 1974 Manchester

There's more to come on Hyman.

[cohenvernonportner]

Henrietta Brown married Samuel Vellensky in the South Broughton Synagogue in Q2 1920.

Samuel was born in Q1 1893 in Manchester to Hyman Levy Vellensky (b. 1866 Poland, d. 1927), a tailor, and Sara née Levy (b. 1868 London, d. 1929).

Hyman and Sarah had married in Manchester's Great Synagogue in Q1 1887.

I have also found the following two death records:

Samuel Vernon, b. 26 Feb 1893, d. Q1 1974 Manchester
Henrietta Vernon, b. 15 Feb 1895, d. Q1 1974 Manchester

There's more to come on Hyman.

So now there is a new name-great work please continue

[ScouseBoy]

Any particular dates or names?


You could also check RootsChat's Surnames Interest Table.

Scroll down to the bottom of any RootsChat page.
Underneath the heading "Your Tools" you fill find "Surname Interests".
Click on that, and then "Quick Search".

Surnames are listed by initial letter.
While you're there, why not add your own interests?

I have found this link for the portner and cohen marriage this is definately the right family but need further back than this one >
Name:   Joseph J Cohen
Event Type:   Marriage Registration
Registration Quarter:   Apr-May-Jun
Registration Year:   1927
Registration District:   Manchester North
County:   Lancashire
Event Place:   Manchester North, Lancashire, England
Spouse Name (available after 1911):   Portner
Volume:   8D
Page:   1400
Line Number:   99



Citing this Record:
"England and Wales Marriage Registration Index, 1837-2005," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVZB-L8NM : accessed 7 December 2015), Joseph J Cohen and null, 1927; from “England & Wales Marriages, 1837-2005,” database, findmypast (http://www.findmypast.com : 2012); citing Marriage Registration, Manchester North, Lancashire, England, General Register Office, Southport, England.


I also found these 4 records and I think one of these must be him

http://search.findmypast.com/results/world-records?firstname=joseph&lastname=cohen&keywordsplace=manchester&sourcecategory=military%20service%20utf0026%20conflict

    I suggest that you purchase a copy of that marriage certificate, if you want to trace back to their parents.

[cohenvernonportner]

Any particular dates or names?


You could also check RootsChat's Surnames Interest Table.

Scroll down to the bottom of any RootsChat page.
Underneath the heading "Your Tools" you fill find "Surname Interests".
Click on that, and then "Quick Search".

Surnames are listed by initial letter.
While you're there, why not add your own interests?

I have found this link for the portner and cohen marriage this is definately the right family but need further back than this one >
Name:   Joseph J Cohen
Event Type:   Marriage Registration
Registration Quarter:   Apr-May-Jun
Registration Year:   1927
Registration District:   Manchester North
County:   Lancashire
Event Place:   Manchester North, Lancashire, England
Spouse Name (available after 1911):   Portner
Volume:   8D
Page:   1400
Line Number:   99



Citing this Record:
"England and Wales Marriage Registration Index, 1837-2005," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVZB-L8NM : accessed 7 December 2015), Joseph J Cohen and null, 1927; from “England & Wales Marriages, 1837-2005,” database, findmypast (http://www.findmypast.com : 2012); citing Marriage Registration, Manchester North, Lancashire, England, General Register Office, Southport, England.


I also found these 4 records and I think one of these must be him

http://search.findmypast.com/results/world-records?firstname=joseph&lastname=cohen&keywordsplace=manchester&sourcecategory=military%20service%20utf0026%20conflict

    I suggest that you purchase a copy of that marriage certificate, if you want to trace back to their parents.

Justin 9above ) has already shared the details thanks

[JustinL]

The attached summarises my discoveries to date. We are now confronted with numerous brick walls.

Marks Vilensky most likely came from the region between Vilnius and the Polish city of Suwalki, although there were also occurrences of the in other regions of Poland in the 1840s.

Based on naming patterns (i.e. names passed down the generations), I am pursuing the theory that the Portner family was closely related to the Portnoi/Portnoy family of Vasilishki, formerly in the Vilna governorate of the Russia Empire, now in northern Belarus. The fact that Ruben and Annie gave one of their sons the unusual name Keva indicates a strong link to Kivel Rubin Portnoi, b. 1822. The latter could have easily fathered a son at the age 50-ish, and could easily have been dead by the time Rubin and Annie named Keva in 1896. It is also feasible that Rubin was Kivel's grandson. We urgently need to establish the name of Rubin's father.

As has been mentioned, you need to order a couple of marriage certificates (Vellensky-Levy in 1887 and Brown-Brown in 1884) in order to be able to progress.