Is it possible to obtain PRONI records on computer disk?

[PGC1962]

Hi all

I've hit a wall trying to find the birth record of my dad Patrick Creaney born (I think) in 1911 in the Armagh/Antrim area.
I think he may not have been recorded with the Creaney surname, and with the christian name Patrick there are just too many possibilities for me to guess at to order certificates to check.
And he may simply have fibbed about his DOB and I'm looking in completely the wrong year.
I think my best bet is to look through lots of local parish records from the area around that time to see if I can narrow it down a bit.

I can't see me getting the chance to get to PRONI anytime soon so was wondering if there is any way of ordering parish birth/baptism records that can be sent on computer disc or similar.

Any suggestions would be greatly received.

Thanks in anticipation.

Patrick

[aghadowey]

The answer is no. PRONI have microfilmed copies of many church records (you can check their site for holdings) but it sounds as though you don't have a particular date of place yet?

If Patrick was illegitimate then his birth should be listed under whatever surname his mother had at the time but perhaps you don't have her name either?

GRONI has a few possibilities-
Patrick Creaney born 12 June 1909 Lurgan district (mother Agnew)
Patrick Creaner born 23 Jan.1910 Newry district (mother Byrne)
male Creaney born 28 July 1911 Lurgan district (mother Creaney)

There's also this on in 1911 age 2-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Aghagallon/Derryhirk/202885

[PGC1962]

Thanks Aghadowey.
I had a feeling the answer would be no.

Daft as it sounds I don't know his mothers name.
The whole time I was growing up I don't remember him ever talking about his family.
What little I know is from my sister who is in her mid seventies and it's been about fifty years since she had any contact with our cousins and I'm struggling to make contact with them.

I think I know which family in the 1911 census he's related to, but need to be able to prove it.

It's all a bit chicken and egg.
Without the birth cert I'm not sure who his mum was.
And without knowing who his mum was I can't be sure I've got the correct birth.

[aghadowey]

What about other certificates for your father? marriage? death? any clues there for you to follow up on?

[PGC1962]

Dad died in Bristol in 1989, I've got his death certificate that has no details of his parents.
It shows his DOB as 17th April 1911.
It was my sister who was the informant and she obviously reported it as she believes it to be.

I've got his WWII army service papers when he was called up in 1942 and he declared his DOB as 17th April 1911 and place of birth as the "parish of Aghagalon".

On his marriage certificate from May 1940 in Bristol, he declared his age as 29, so again 1911 looks consistent (it listed his father as "John Creaney - deceased, linen weaver".

But none of this gets me any closer to finding his birth certificate.

[KGarrad]

Presumably, that's Aghagallon, County Armagh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aghagallon

[aghadowey]

It really is a shame that Patrick just missed being included in 1911 census 

I checked Crean* births for the period in GROBI's database without finding anything close enough to that birthdate.

Then went to 1911 census and searched for John Creaney with weaver as occupation- only 3 results. So, I know have a theory which I can't prove-

John Creaney, weaver, with a daughter Mary. This is the correct area for Patrick's birth.
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Aghagallon/Derryclone/202877
If Patrick was illegitimate then he might have given his grandfather's name when he got married (this is fairly common).
Mother? Mary Creaney could have gotten married after 1911 and child raised with her family. There are several possible Lurgan marriages (9 Apr.1911 to John Burrell, 1915, 1918) with and without middle names.

Same family?
Administration of the Estate of Patrick Creaney late of Derryclone County Antrim Farmer who died 30 April 1902 granted at Belfast to Mary Ann Creaney the Widow.

The above theory is, at the moment speculation based on Patrick's father listed as John a weaver and his birthdate and place.

One possible source to check now is school registers (PRONI, Belfast have a large collection). They list child's name, age (in years & months) or exact birthdate, date of enrollment, residence (townland or street), religion, father's occupation.

[PGC1962]

Hi Aghadowey

There's a family storey that dad was raised by his "sister" Lizzie Lavery.
Lizzie Creaney had married James Lavery.
Someone on RC very kindly managed to put me in touch with one of Lizzie's grandchildren, Nick, and Nick's mum remember's visiting my dad in Bristol in the 1960's and her husband referred to my dad as his cousin (I think Lizzie was a young aunty rather than his sister).
I also remember a cousin of dad's called Noel Lavery coming to visit us when I was little.
So I know there is a definite connection here.

Nick has told me his grandma Lizzie Creaney was the youngest child in this particular family.

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai001583372/

So I'm now trying to document a link back from Lizzie to check this is the right family.

My feeling is it's possible that my granddad may have been William John in this family, but known to the family as simply John.
Or as you say my dad may have used his granddad's name for his marriage certificate which also fits.

I think I'm close to cracking it, just need a few bits to fall into place.
A birth certificate would just make everything a whole lot simpler.

Checking school registers sounds like a good idea.
But again it depends on me getting across to Proni to do it.

Thanks again for all the suggestions.

[PGC1962]

Hi.

Is it possible to link threads?  Gaffy posted the below on an on thread from a couple of years ago.




Posted by: gaffy
« on: Yesterday at 16:20 » Insert Quote
From another angle, when James Lavery married Lizzie Creaney (father John, linen weaver) on 20 January 1926, the fact she was full age should make her show in the 1911 census ...

Is this Lizzie (Elizabeth / Eliza, etc.) married to James Lavery the right one?


Thanks Gaffy.
Yesterday I asked GRONI to search for a marriage certificate for James and Lizzie in the mid 1920's.
So this date looks like it could be them.
Hopefully the certificate will confirm where Lizzie was living prior to the marriage which may proof a link to the correct family.