John Rogers born c1836 & Ellen Jeffrey c1842

[catfordcrooner]

They are my 2x Great Grandparents but I can't find much on their family, i.e. parents and siblings. I know from their 1865 marriage in Newcastle that John's father is James Rogers and Ellen's is Alexander Jeffrey. On the censuses John's birthplace varies from Berwick upon Tweed; just Scotland; Berwickshire Whitsome Swinton (1911). Ellen's normally says Scotland but Stirlingshire Stirling Town on 1911 census (where she has been entered as Helen)

Any help would be great

Thanks

Jeff

[Kay99]

Does the marriage cert give their father's occupations and any names of witnesses?

Kay

[Kay99]

In 1871 I think John and Ellen's surname is transcribed as Rogus and they are living at Wallsend

Living with them and listed as a son is Alexander Rogers age 11 born Neston Cheshire. Presumably born prior to John and Ellen's marriage and therefore most probably born Alexander Jeffrey and named after Ellen's father

Found an Alexander Jaffrey age 1 born Cheshire in 1861 living as nephew with the following family in Roberts Row, Saltney, Great Boughton, Cheshire.  Their surname is transcribed as Muller but looks more like Miller.

Agnes Muller Wife Married    30    Blacksmiths Wife Scotland    
John    Muller11   Scotland    
Robert Muller 9    Scotland    
Agnes Muller 3    Scotland    
Ellen    Muller1 Chester, Cheshire, England    
Alexander    Jaffery    Nephew    1 Chester, Cheshire, England    
William    Cray    Lodger    23    Plumber    Scotland    
John    Gallacher    Lodger    26    Blacksmiths Labourer    Ireland

Kay

Edit - There is a birth of an Alexander   Rogers in Jun Qtr 1860 Wirral 8a   408

[Kay99]

In 1851 Agnes Miller and her son and husband are living at North End, St Ninians, Cambusbarron, Stirlingshire with her mother and family including sister Helen

Agnes Douglas 46 Head Married b St Ninians, Stirlingshire
Daniel(or David) Jaffray 12 Son
Helen Jaffray 9 d Daughter
John Miller 21 Son in law b Orkney Tile Worker
Agnes Miller 19 Daughter  b Stirling
John Miller 1 Grandson
Wilson(or William) Jaffray 7 Son

Kay

Edit I can't see the family at the moment in 1841

[willsy]

Did find this one, bit out with age I know but

1841 St Ninian's King Street
Alex Jaffray    25 Occ Dyer
Agnes Jaffray    25
Hellen Jaffray    4 Mo

[Kay99]

Re John Rogers - There appear to be two John Rogers born in the Whinsome/Duns area of Berwickshire

In 1861 there was a John Rogers b 1836 in Whitsome, Berwickshire who was an able seaman in the Navy working in a vessel in the English Channel.   I can't see him pre 1861 at the moment
 RG 9 Piece 4439 Folio 17 Page 10 

In 1851 there was also a John Roger age 15 living in the Parish of Duns near Whitsome as below

Mary Winram 47  b Ayton, berwsh
Alison Roger 23 Dressmaker
John Roger 15 Apprentice Draper's
Margaret Winram 9
George Winram    5

Looks like the same family in 1841 is living at Sunnyside Duns with husband James.  Sadly this family has moved to Bury by 1861 with this John Rogers is listed as stepson of James and Mary Nenram(looks like Winram)with siblings Margaret and George Winsom.   This John later married Jane Taylor Ankers in 1862 in Bury and was living there in 1871 so can be discounted

The first John looks the most likely

Kay
 

[Kay99]

In 1841 there is a John Shutridge age 5 living with a Rogers family as below in the village of Whitsome.  I can't see John Shutridge post 1841 - I wonder if he took the surname Rogers??

Alison Rogers 60
Alison Rogers 25
Alison Rogers 8
John Shutridge 5

Edit By 1851 The family surname appears to have been transcribed as Rodger as below and John is now a Rodger -  Still living in the parish of Whinsome

Alison Rodger 70 b Greenlaw Berwickshire
Alison Rodger 34 b Stichel, Berwickshire Farm Lab
John Rodger 15 b Dunse
Agnes Rodger 4 b Whitsome

[Kay99]

The National Archive has a record relating to a John Rogers born in the Parish of Whitsome in Feb 1836.  His date of volunteering for the Navy was 6 June 1859 
 http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7889115

[catfordcrooner]

Thanks Kay and Willsy

The ages of Alice, Agnes and John in the 1871 census do match the later census and you can see how the transcriber would write Rogus instead of Rogers. Some brilliant research has been done for me.

Jeff