Author Topic: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.  (Read 87194 times)

Offline despair

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #126 on: Sunday 31 August 14 11:05 BST (UK) »
I wonder if there is any relationship due to timing re the 1756 will of David Richards?

On a separate note I can see the CCED record for John Richards given as 1808-1826 Llnerchymedd-has he been identified outside of this time frame?

Regards
Roger

Offline Viking666

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #127 on: Sunday 31 August 14 14:34 BST (UK) »
   [Born at Bryn Isaf, Lledrod, Cardigan. It is said that he was ordained at the Bishop's Palace at Abergwilli, Carmarthen on the 24th. of August, 1783. He took up residence at Llanerchymedd, (perhaps at Ty-Coch, 8 High Street, a property that appears in his will), and presumably lived there until his marriage to Ann Parry.]

  This is the entry that I have for the Rev. John. I know the entries for 1808 and 1826 intimately; they were my basis for disbelieving that he obtained a degree at Oxford. The entries are from the Clerical list of Wales and show that he was educated to 'Lit' standard, meaning that he was without a degree but that he was educated enough to be a priest. The only time that he is referred to with a degree, (BA), is on his burial tablet inside St. Mary's Church, and later, on the gravestones of his family. (The son, or daughter, of the Rev. John Richards, M.A.)
 Other entries that I have are as follows.

Extract from the "Cambro-Briton" of 7th. March, 1820.
"The other officers were chosen for the present year and the Rev. John Richards of Anglesey was proposed as an Honourable Member and as Critic of the Society, on which occasion an address from that Gentleman was read and deservedly applauded for the critical ability which it disclosed."

   Extract from Archaeologi Cambriensis. John Skinner, 1808.
"I here had to regret the loss of my walking stick; I shrewdly suspected that the Cleric, (Rev. John Richards), had taken a fancy to it, there being no other person in the churchyard excepting our own party. This gentleman seems to have paid a good deal of attention to the Antiquities, but superstition is not confined to the ignorant and illiterate. He believes in fairies and stated that he had chased them away from the churchyard many times. !"

 He is sometimes referred to as being a guarantor as to the good character of others; mentions in Druidic papers but never with a degree after his name. He began his Clerical duties at Llanerchymedd in 1784, shortly after his ordination at Abergwilli.

 On the other point that you mention. Edward schoolmaster was the lifelong friend of James Lloyd of Mabws. Both were, according to various reports, very influential in the area. I thought that David Richards moved to Ffos in 1757 but I see a doc where he is stated as being of Ffos, dated 1754.
 
  A separate issue. I'm still leaning towards Thomas, (son of Morgan Richards, son of the Rev. David Richards of Llandewi, passed to the Rev. Davies and ending up in a house that, perhaps after the date of 1756, belonged to the Church, or Ystradmeurig School), as being the father of John and James. The dates that we have fit the narrative and if Jane, the mother, died shortly after the birth of James then Thomas, as a widower with at least 2 children, would re-marry as soon as possible, as was the style in those days. James' son, John was educated at Ystradmeurig school and he started working at the Customs House in Liverpool at the age of 12. The 6 year education period would mean that from 1769 to 1775, James himself, would have been at the school, (John at Oxford), neither being dependent on their parents for sustenance.  We don't know where the Rev Richard of Llandewi was born. He may be the link to the other Richard/s in our area.

                                                      Regards from Peter.
Richards in Anglesey. Liverpool, Cardiganshire.
Richards in Patagonia and Canada. Owens and Williams in Holyhead. Laird family, Birkenhead. Richards-Bridges family, Epsom.

Offline despair

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #128 on: Sunday 31 August 14 15:35 BST (UK) »
Another very long shot-I don't suppose "Customs and Excise" was a profession that ran through the family?

Release. David Richards of the parish of Lledrod, Gent, and  Richard Richards of Lledrod parish Cardiganshire, County Officer of Excise in the first part, and Jenkin Jones of the parish of Lledrod, Gent., in the second. In consideration of £140 the Richards released to Jenkin Jones the water grist mill with appurtenances called Lledrod Mill.
1 March 1786

There is a death record for Richard Richards,Lledrod 1812 but no age.I can't find a will nor any other reference to him.

Regards
Roger

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #129 on: Sunday 31 August 14 16:37 BST (UK) »
  Yes, I noticed that entry for Richard Richards but assumed that he wasn't one of "ours" but an official from Cardigan or even Aberystwyth. There are no other Customs Officers in the family but see the following entry in my tree for James Richards, the 5th child of James, Bryn Issa.

 [James was prosecuted in 1860 by H.M.Customs and Excise for adulterating tobacco with lime, (231 lbs of tobacco plus 933 lbs of lime; ordered to be destroyed); he was also fined.£75.]
 His uncle John, the ex-customs officer was living in Llanerchymedd at that time and I wonder whether it was him that "shopped" him!

 The major pattern in the family is, of course, farming; followed by Clerics, including the marriages of female Richards to Clerics. There is also a hint of a "Clerical Mafioso" at work in the early family. Michael, 2nd son of Rev. John, was the tenant of 600 acres at Parciau. Resident at Parciau at that time was the Rev. Williams, Marquis of Anglesey's family. John's daughter Anne married Humphrey Jones Evans the surgeon, his father was the vicar of Heneglwys, and so on.

                  Regards from Peter.
,
Richards in Anglesey. Liverpool, Cardiganshire.
Richards in Patagonia and Canada. Owens and Williams in Holyhead. Laird family, Birkenhead. Richards-Bridges family, Epsom.


Offline despair

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #130 on: Sunday 31 August 14 22:07 BST (UK) »
I have found a slightly earlier connection of the Richards family with Middlesex.There is a 1765 will for Benjamin Richards,St George Hanover Square,in which he bequeaths all his personal estate of whatever kind(sadly not specified),to his brother Thomas,with proviso for his sisters Mary and Rachael(sic).This is the family of Morgan Richards.This also means that Benjamin must have died aged 33 approx. as he was just leaving his minority in the 1749 will of his father Morgan.

I'll see if I can find any earlier connections.

Regards
Rogeer

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #131 on: Monday 01 September 14 10:26 BST (UK) »
This new information adds more credence to my comments in the last para. of my yesterdays' 14.32 post. (I have 2 members of the Richards family living at Hanover Square in the 1920's ... no connection except that they both, eventually, became Lawyers).
 I wonder what came first ... the move to London and then the meeting with Lucy, or whether they met and married at Lledrod and then moved to London. The former seems more probable as we see  Benjamin dying in 1765 so he was already there. Hanover Square suggests a change of fortune for someone ... was Lucy English and had Benjamin already married into her family?
 I'd like to know what Thomas was doing in Lledrod. He's the only member of the family there at this time. Was he educated at the Edward School and, heavens above, was he a Cleric as was his Grandfather, guardian and eldest son?
 So many hypotheses but one may be close to the mark. There are other similar scenarios in the Richards family.
                                 regards from Peter.

 
Richards in Anglesey. Liverpool, Cardiganshire.
Richards in Patagonia and Canada. Owens and Williams in Holyhead. Laird family, Birkenhead. Richards-Bridges family, Epsom.

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #132 on: Monday 01 September 14 10:34 BST (UK) »
I don't know whether this is a valid connection or not:-
You have the first mention of "Bryn Issa" associated with a Thomas Lewis in 1658.
There is a will of 1695 for Thomas Lewis,gent,Llanddewi Brefi.While I can't see Bryn Issa mentioned he does leave Tyddyn y Rhyd Lwid in Lledrod to his eldest son John Thomas.
There was the association later of Letitia Richards,widow and Thomas Richards of Penybrin Merllyd with Rhyd Lwyd,which was also the site of a school as mentioned previously.

Regards
Roger

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #133 on: Monday 01 September 14 12:59 BST (UK) »
1658, Nov. 24
INDENTURE, (counterpart), being a grant from John Vaughan of Trowscoed, co. Card., esq., to Thomas Lewis of p. Lledrod, co. Card., yeoman, of a tmt called Tythin-y-bryn-issa and two parcels of land called Ynis-y-garne and Ynis-y-bervedd, being three-eighths of an ancient tmt called Bryn-merllyd in said p. Lledrod and in gr. Mevenith.
 
  We can see that this person is Thomas Lewis, of Lledrod, yeoman and is not the same person as the Thomas Lewis in the 1695 Will. By 1695 the properties had changed hands 3 or 4 times.

  The subject of the School at Rhyd Llwyd is more complicated. I can't remember the exact story but the school was established at the time that the Ystrad school  was opened. A beneficiary financed the school and left funds for it to continue after her death. A legal problem cropped up with those arrangements and was resolved by setting up a trust, with a board to determine how funds were to be allocated.  Perhaps the school was later amalgamated with the Edward Richard school and, as per the 1765 bequest of Edward would have needed a trustee to facilitate the management of the properties. Leticia may have been one of the trustees.
 
  The last "owner" of Bryn Issaf, before Thomas and Jane, was Edward Richard, as per his Bequest of 1765.
[Bryn-pervedd, situate in the lordship of Sputty,' and other properties to pay a schoolmaster etc.]

Here is one of your earlier posts.
1769(I)-associated with payment re Hendre Rees and a move to Westminster. Is the marriage in Westminster of a son(moved after his father died?) or a late other marriage, perhaps, if Jane has died(?) with Thomas himself also dying before 1777?
                                               regards from Peter.
               
Richards in Anglesey. Liverpool, Cardiganshire.
Richards in Patagonia and Canada. Owens and Williams in Holyhead. Laird family, Birkenhead. Richards-Bridges family, Epsom.

Offline despair

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Re: David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.
« Reply #134 on: Monday 01 September 14 15:11 BST (UK) »
I have been looking for earlier evidence of Thomas Richards in London.There is a Thomas as witness to the marriage of Rachael in 1767,and it looks like he signed as executor of Benjamin's will there in 1765.Neither of these guarantee of course that he was resident at the time.Having recognised the possibility that he was,I have looked for earlier deaths Of Jane Richards that would make sense if he was the Thomas who married Lucy Walters in 1770.There are two reasonable candidates,one in 1763 and  one in 1765.The earlier date might bring into question James birth place so the second looks more likely(?).

Regards
Roger